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Planetary Talismans
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LeoRising



Joined: 23 Sep 2008
Posts: 11

Posted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 7:31 pm    Post subject: Planetary Talismans Reply with quote

Is there anyone participating on this forum who has worn a Planetary Talisman for any length of time? I've been wearing a SUN talisman for about 2 months and I've yet to notice any benefit from it. I'm wondering how long it must be worn before it's power kicks in and benefits become perceivable?

If anyone has worn a planetary talisman longer than I've worn mine, I'd like to read about your experince with it. What have you noticed, if anything.

The concept of planetary talismans is incredibly appealing to me, yet I must admit that I have some skepticism. I am making an effort to be open-minded about it. Having spent more than $200 for the talisman I'm wearing, I've not allowed my doubts to keep me from wearing a talisman and finding out first hand. However, I am growing impatient for results.

I've attempted to discuss this with the astrologer who elected the time for the creation of the talisman, but any admittance of skepticism is taken by him as a personal attack, so I'm still looking for an outlet to discuss this matter.
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yuzuru



Joined: 01 Apr 2005
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Posted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello, magic is such a complex theme, but I would suggest that maybe:

1 - magic is often disappointing, to me at least, as I am not a magician. It work only when it feels too, apparently. And talismans and other tools have seldon any effect at all with me.
2 - are your goals achievable? Maybe only lesser effects are visible. I would suggest taking it off for a week, than putting it on and see if there is any difference
3 - maybe you should try to do a little evocation of the intelligence or the archangel of the planet

best regards
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Olivia



Joined: 15 Oct 2008
Posts: 866

Posted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sometimes the magic works, sometimes it doesn't?

My own talismans have been a DIY affair, and useful. Sadly, I lost one that I made some years ago that did have a pronounced effect, and there won't be a comparable planetary alignment for another 45 years - so I hope I find the thing again.

Aside from solar I don't know what your talisman was or was supposed to be, or who elected the time or made it for you. Even if it's solar, if it's predominantly fixed signs, I'd expect slow success in whatever area.

And sadly, the field is full of charlatans - not saying your astrologer was or is, but it's possible.
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epurdue



Joined: 14 Nov 2007
Posts: 327

Posted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 8:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know who made the talisman, but even the most experienced planetary magicians can't guarantee that a talisman will work. I know someone like Chris Warnock isn't selling a guarantee, he is selling the cost of materials and the time it takes to make the astrological election and for its fabrication.

Part of the issue could also be the state of the Sun in your natal chart. If it's afflicted, then there's a good chance it isn't working for that reason. At least that's a popular theory.
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###



Joined: 08 Jul 2004
Posts: 1380

Posted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 10:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've read that they're useless unless you make them yourself, the power coming from your act and involvement. Otherwise, they're just another product off the shelf. I have no personal experience, though.


Edited to add:
Quote:
I've attempted to discuss this with the astrologer who elected the time for the creation of the talisman, but any admittance of skepticism is taken by him as a personal attack ...

Shocked Run away as fast as you can! That one needs to be 'encouraged' to quit the business.
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epurdue



Joined: 14 Nov 2007
Posts: 327

Posted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 2:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kirk wrote:
I've read that they're useless unless you make them yourself, the power coming from your act and involvement. Otherwise, they're just another product off the shelf. I have no personal experience, though.


That's a more modern take. Traditionally there is no problem with this. It's certainly better to do them yourself in that YOU have a connection with the planetary spirit, and the act of the ritual itself can be rewarding. However the power of a planetary talisman comes not from you, but from the planetary spirit.
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J K Sharma



Joined: 23 Dec 2007
Posts: 45

Posted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 3:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Planetary Talismans Reply with quote

[quote="LeoRising"]Is there anyone participating on this forum who has worn a Planetary Talisman for any length of time? I've been wearing a SUN talisman for about 2 months and I've yet to notice any benefit from it. I'm wondering how long it must be worn before it's power kicks in and benefits become perceivable?
If anyone has worn a planetary talisman longer than I've worn mine, I'd like to read about your experince with it. What have you noticed, if anything. [quote]

Hello

Use of Talisman to reduce or increase Planet's effect is very common in Indian Astrology. What I have observed that on remeadial side: Western astrology focus on psychological councilling while Indian astrology have more focus on donation of eatables or like that or chanting of mantra, using Talisman, Homa etc.

Back to you question, to reduce or increase Planet's effect Talisman are very common in Indian Astrology, here talisman is known as "Yantra".
According to planet or Diety, the type of talisman varies. Also Yantra on primary bases divided in Three categories:
1. Fixed at one place, like in Temple etc.
2. To wear on body. and
3. Ready to use, means prepared at the time of worship of the diety. After completion of worship (Puja), that yantra is removed.

After above classification, Yantra's body material is very importent like:

1. Yantra prepared with Metals ( Like: Gold, silver, copper ect)
2. Yantra written in Bhojpatra or normal paper with a speical kind of Ink.
3. Yantra prepared by precious stones.

Also the further Yantra are classified as Nuemeric or pure Geometrical.

The next question is; which you have asked; time period For Yantra to show its effect. It is very complex question, no one can 100% accurartely predict the the strength and time duration of effect. As per planetry, remeadies, first need to check the position of Sun in your horoscope, also which type of Talisman you are using is necessary to know: Like metal based or paper written, in which aupcious time it was prepared and at what time(Muhrta) you got it. Also where are you using it like on Body or worship, also its daily worship method etc. For futher discusion you can send your all above details

Hope you may look futher in this respect.

Regards

J K Sharma
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LeoRising



Joined: 23 Sep 2008
Posts: 11

Posted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The way that works best for me and for my clients also, is to perform a simple hands-on meditation ceremony at an astrologically auspicious time for the planet under consideration. The main benefit of this method is having no need to wear a talisman, or gem. Rather the planetary energy is brought directly into the energy system via the chakra corresponding to the planet thru simple polarity therapy contacts. Over a period of time, an Inner Planetary Empowerment ceremony can be performed for each of the chakra/planet associations. I also teach my clients how to use polarity therapy contacts to move the energy around the planetary circle which I refer to as The Sacred Circle of Transformation. Once it is empowered with planetary energy, the Sacred Circle is a powerful tool for making desired changes in ones life.

Since this little known method has worked so well for me, I thought perhaps that using the much better known method of wearing a talisman would be even more effective. In the available literature, talismans and gems are the most common means of increasing planetary energy. I've found next to nothing in regard to bringing the planetary energy DIRECTLY into ones own energy system. I've had to rely on my intuition for guidance.

So, perhaps my skeptisim regarding talismans is the main culprit, hindering my lack of preceivable benefits. On the other hand, after 30 plus years of doing polarity therapy, working with energy systems, it's so easy for me to trust the inflow of planetary energy directly into the energy system without going thru the medium of a talisman or precious gem. I guess I'm a bit unusual in that regard. Some part of me probably sees the talsiman as a hindrance. It makes sense in theory anyway if you like good ole psycho babble!
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delaforge



Joined: 06 Jan 2007
Posts: 130

Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2009 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi LeoRising:

The matter of talismans is a complicated one both from the point of view of the time of the talisman being made and the time it is charged or empowered. Few people know the correct formulae for the timing of a consecration of planetary talismans, and unless the formulae are adhered to, the result is at best a weak talisman or more probably one that has no energy charge whatsoever.

You speak of working yourself when “an astrologically auspicious time for the planet under consideration” is in force. After 30 plus years of doing polarity therapy and working with energy systems, are you able to sense, to apprehend, energy yourself? I assume not, or you would have felt the energy in the talisman when you received it. But to those trained in the sensing of energy, the ‘feel’ of a charged talisman is quite different from the ‘feel’ of an uncharged one.

The British occultist Madeline Montalban has written about her experiences in this field. She was making an item that wasn’t a planetary talisman but was to be endowed with what we might call talismanic properties. She tells us: “During this time I acquired the knowledge of how to melt and purify pure silver, and I discovered that good results were not merely obtained by working when the Moon was in Cancer (that being only part of the secret). Certain other planets had to be in good aspect too, with the Sun occupying either a watery or airy sign at the time.”

“By combining all these factors and using trial and error, I discovered that I could fashion [a] “magically pure” silver sheet with a powerful vibration all of its own, and distinguished in some special way, from the silver made when only the Moon occupied its designated place.”

The two points I have already made are brought out in Madeline Montalban’s testimony. One, that the astral configurations one needs to work under are more subtle and complex than most texts would have us believe and Two, that items that have been magically worked on, under the correct configurations, have a distinct ‘feel’ clearly apparent to anyone trained in, say, a psychic skill such as psychometry. Olivia appears to know quite a bit about point one, for she understands that some significant configurations come about only rarely, and that working without the benefit of those configurations will avail one but little benefit . . . or, as I have said above, none at all.

Perhaps, if you are not qualified to ‘feel’ your talisman’s energy yourself, you might seek out a psychometrist and have them ‘sense’ it for you.

Delaforge
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epurdue



Joined: 14 Nov 2007
Posts: 327

Posted: Tue Feb 10, 2009 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And actually I don't really think "feeling" something is good enough. I have done planetary talismans that worked amazingly well, yet I had no feeling when wearing them or making them.

I am extremely strict though. I make the talismans at a certain exact times, and I even make incense recipes and wear clothes as close to the descriptions as possible.
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###



Joined: 08 Jul 2004
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Posted: Wed Feb 11, 2009 12:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's the quote from Madeline Montalban:

Quote:
“By combining all these factors and using trial and error, I discovered that I could fashion [a] “magically pure” silver sheet with a powerful vibration all of its own, and distinguished in some special way, from the silver made when only the Moon occupied its designated place.”

This is a potential mine field. Are we really looking at superstition, deception and delusion? About this “silver sheet with a powerful vibration all of its own”: Was Montalban the sole experiencer of the “powerful vibration”? Or was it tested with equipment which demonstrated that there was indeed a powerful vibration, a force that wasn't there before her efforts? We can easily become too credulous when we take someone's word that through her efforts she created something with a “powerful vibration”, and when she is the sole judge of the result. Just as potentially delusional is when others claim to sense the vibrations along with her or him simply because they believe they do.

Contained within this discussion of talismans is the astrological argument of whether the planets have an actual force or whether its a matter of focusing the mind in a certain manner at a certain time and place. The idea of the planets themselves having some sort of force seems especially prone to superstition.

The most serious common mistake with talismans is the simplistic idea that 'If I want it I can have it. I just need the right gizmo to bring it to me'.
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epurdue



Joined: 14 Nov 2007
Posts: 327

Posted: Wed Feb 11, 2009 1:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It seems to me that if someone is an astrologer or believes in astrology, then they shouldn't have a philosophical issue with planetary magic. If they have a moral issue with it, I can't comment either way.

If someone believes that a natal chart or a horary chart indicates something substantive, then there must be some kind of influence - whether that influence be spiritual or material can be debated. To criticize someone's use of the word "vibration" as not "tested with equipment which demonstrated that there was indeed a powerful vibration" is minefield as well since to date, no materialistic reason for planetary effects on natal or horary has been determined.

So in the end, either the planets have effects or they don't. If you practice astrology, then you either believe planets have effects that can be measured through astrological technique, or you are doing it for fun.

If you believe the planets have effects on birth or horary questions, then it isn't too hard to flip that around for timing best times for events - i.e. electional astrology.

If you believe events can be timed propitiously, then again this presupposes planetary effects on terrestial things. If there can be planetary effects on planetary things, then it isn't a huge leap to take these propitious timings to one's own advantage.

The idea is simply taking a time when a planet is in its best place zodiacally and harnessing that into an object made for that purpose.

So if one thinks that astrological magic is supersitious, and that person is an astrologer, then that in itself is a slippery slope.
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Morpheus



Joined: 21 Mar 2007
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Location: Rawalpindi/Islamabad (Pakistan)

Posted: Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only effective Talisman (Taweez/Naqsh--Urdu) is prepared by the

help of electing a proper time (use electional chart).
A square (totalling figure corresponding to your need plus a religious text that figure is arrived and invoking an angel, a devil (djin) and a thought form (Mowakul in Urdu)

/or an insignia

and use of herbs and aromatics corresponding to planet/planets selected, on the line of homeopathic magic as described by Sir James Frazer.

A Talisman can improve things, but it can not grant what has not been promised in Natal chart. In some rare cases, it grants that un-promised things, but the cost (in spiritual/material) is so high that one has to admire the divine intelligence for striking the balance at every cost.

If the Sun in your natal chart is not a desired planet OR it was making un-wanted aspects, the Talisman may not work or work in an adverse way.

The time? how long it takes to work.


Depends on factors above considered.
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###



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Posted: Wed Feb 11, 2009 6:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
So in the end, either the planets have effects or they don't.

That's the debate! I don't think they do. I think many astrologers tend to think the same way if they stop to reflect on it.


Quote:
If you practice astrology, then you either believe planets have effects that can be measured through astrological technique, or you are doing it for fun.

I don't believe it. Many astrologers don't – and not just those who have a lot of fun with their astrology. That's why the debate exists over whether or not the planets cause events and results, whether they produce the effects.


Quote:
If you believe events can be timed propitiously, then again this presupposes planetary effects on terrestial things
.
Not at all! It's a matter of matching actions and states with moments in time. If a you want some romance and 'hot action' then choose a time when Venus and Mars are in a working relationship (Just as an example. That's simplistic electional astrology!) You are matching the results you wish for with an appropriate quality of time. You aren't picking a time when planet Venus and planet Mars can put their atmospheres together and produce what you want. You are choosing a Venus-Mars time – an occasion of Venus-Mars qualities and Venus-Mars imagery. The 'power' comes from matching the qualities of a moment with one's intentions. Matching the mind with appropriate imagery. That's all the magic you need. But we know it doesn't mean we're guaranteed to get what we want.

Any magical work, including astrological talismans, can be superstitiously approached and loaded with lots of delusions. It's a more psychologically dangerous territory than delineation of natal or horary charts due to the inevitable focus on one's own will and power. Therefore it's especially important to be cautious of others who are in the business. And that brings us back to this sentence from the original post:

Quote:
I've attempted to discuss this with the astrologer who elected the time for the creation of the talisman, but any admittance of skepticism is taken by him as a personal attack ...


I wasn't just trying to be funny when I said to run away. It's a very wise idea to stay away from that crowd, or to proceed with extreme caution if proceed you must.
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kerenhappuch



Joined: 07 Jul 2005
Posts: 396
Location: UK

Posted: Wed Feb 11, 2009 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi LeoRising,
To respond to your initial post, I agree with Mithra6 - any planetary talisman or "alignment" such as wearing certain colours, etc, will not produce good results if that planet is in a poor condition (ie powerless, acting as a malefic etc) in your nativity. In effect you are "tapping into" the energies of that planet, and those energies will be a combination of the timing of the talisman, and your natal position/qualities. For example if your Sun is in Libra or Aquarius then I would not expect a Sun talisman to produce positive effects. Did you select a Sun talisman on the basis of your natal chart (did the astrologer look at your natal chart and say you would benefit from a "pepping up" of your Sun energies?) or was it selected on the basis of "I want some Sun energies in my life", without looking at how this fits into your chart?

My personal experience is that talismans do work, but only as an adjunct to the whole "magickal" or "affirmative" process of life change. I.e. you can't just wear one and expect to experience positive effects. I have also found that if your natal planet isn't up to scratch, you will be confronted with this if you make a talisman to "amp it up"! A natally peregrine planet, or one that is afflicted, will not produce positive results.

Keren
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