tom - thanks for chiming in!

waybread, when an article like the newyorker starts off with the question "When did Russian intelligence give WikiLeaks the e-mails that it hacked from the Democratic National Committee and John Podesta, and how did it transmit them? "
that is akin to me asking you a ''when did you first start beating your wife'' type question... it is a loaded question, isn't it? surely you are capable of seeing this much...

also, an indictment is not the same as fact.... regarding the quotes of assange, it doesn't say how he got the e mails does it? and yet you appear to want to swallow what the indictment and authors musings are - russia gave them to him...and the mueller investigation wasn't interested in interviewing assange to ask him this question was it?? skip all the other possibilities and go straight to the ''russia done it meme'''.. no - i think you need to keep pompeos recent comment in mind when digesting the msm fodder you say you love to chew on...
‘We Lied, Cheated and Stole’:
United States Secretary of State and former Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) director (2017 - 2018), Mike Pompeo, admitted to an audience from Texas A&M University on April 15,2019 that the agency especially trains employees to “lie, cheat and steal.???

and yet, there are countless folks that are unable or unwilling to entertain alternative possibilities in spite of this, yourself included...

i did a post on assange in the sidereal forum... in fact, i continue to find the sidereal data very convincing... you can check it out.. i haven't made any political commentary in it either! http://skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=10497

some reading material..
https://consortiumnews.com/2019/04/30/v ... ns-us-all/

Tom, I take your point about Assange's personality being whatever people want it to be, using the horoscope as their evidence.

In modern astrology, this would be explained by Neptune conjunct his ascendant. With Neptune, we don't get reality, we get illusions and disillusionment. With the "good Julian" getting so much attention on this thread, I thought that the opposite side needed some air time, to create some sense of balance.

I would enjoy reading a traditional interpretation of Assange's chart

OK, James-- so much for your not wanting me to post a non-astrological discussion.

The trouble with far-left and far-right people who won't follow the mainstream media is that they remain unaware of the difficult work that war correspondents, political reporters, and investigative journalists are actually doing. Other mainstream outlets would be something like Amnesty International.

The trouble with MSM-avoiders is that they don't seem to appreciate the huge differences between, say, Fox News and MSNBC. Oh, and Pravda is a mainstream outlet, as well. Combining these helps create a sense of balance.

Oftentimes MSM-avoiders are also uninformed of the long history of US courts' liberal interpretation of the First Amendment to the Constitution. It is illegal to hack into a computer and steal information. That's theft. If no bigger issue is at stake with disseminating stolen information (like people's lives,) it is legal for media to publish it. Which the mainstream media repeatedly do, concerning WikiLeaks.

Kind of ironic, but in the USA, that's how it works. You can't steal information, but if you did, you can publish it.

This is why, as of now, Assange is wanted on only one charge of computer hacking in the United States. More charges might develop, but right now, his trying to help Chelsea Manning crack a password is it.

If Julian Assange is your hero, I'm not going to dissuade you. I merely need to state for the record the position of millions of ordinary Americans-- who had no involvement with US interventions overseas, and who never supported them, but who now-- thanks in part to WikiLeaks' dumps so close to the 2016 elections-- are dealing with Donald Trump as president.

I think he's a mad man doing terrible things to my birth country, but you may approve of him.

Even if, for the sake of argument, we take your point that WikiLeaks did not collaborate with Russian operatives on this, we still have the problem of its efforts to swing a Democratic election.

This type of intervention is sort of one of the dislikes Assange has of the US. Kind of ironic.

Vladimir Putin is happy that Trump is in the White House.

By all means, James, PM me on this if you wish to carry on with Assange collaborating with Russian operatives.

waybread,

you've wanted to continue here, as opposed to pm'ing me on any of itt.. that much is clear... your post is full of the same talking points that have been regurgitated 24/7 in the msm.. unfortunately even if a person was able to unplug from the msm, they'll be told about it ad nausea-um anyway, as you're showcasing here... so have the last word on all the same talking points that get endlessly repeated and that have been drilled into your head.. it isn't going to change the fact that others will see it exactly opposite or differently..

as for the neptune rising and good verses bad julian - beauty and ugliness is in the eye of the beholder and worth remembering... as to what it does or doesn't have to do with the person, remains to be seen.. the opposite side you offer is the one that is peddled 24/7 in the msm.. so really you aren't offering anything novel - in fact, it is just the opposite.. but oh, do continue and i will continue likewise..

here is some astro for you - mercury square pluto.. picking up the vibe yet??

from 2010 - and still true..

Wikileak's Main Aim Is To Reveal Hypocrisy
https://www.moonofalabama.org/2010/12/w ... crisy.html

difficult to understand

James, stooping to repetitive personal insults about my intelligence doesn't make your argument. It merely shows that you're out of debate arrows in your quiver. I spent most of my working life having to engage in critical thinking as part of my employment. So I am bemused by your implication that I am one of the sheeple.

I'm afraid you've got a fallacy of over-generalization or straw man tactic going on about mainstream media. Which is easy to do if you seldom follow it.

What WikiLeaks says about itself and how it actually operates are two different matters. That's not unusual.

Maybe that's Neptunian.

BTW, the full redacted Mueller report is available at https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/18/politics ... index.html

The material on WikiLeaks start on p. 52.

Assange himself wrote in 2015, during Clinton's presidential campaign: "We believe it would be much better for GOP [Republicans] to win...Dems+media+liberals would then form a block to reign in their worst qualities.... With Hillary in charge GOP will be pushing for her worst qualities...dems+media+neoliberals will be mute....She's a bright, well connected, sadistic sociopath."

So there's no doubt about WikiLeaks as a foreign actor in American politics. This wasn't just some kind of free speech issue in their dump of DNC emails.

Clinton nevertheless did win a majority of the popular vote in 2016, but not the electoral college. Assange put his political beliefs above the will of the American people.

I cannot imagine Canadians accepting this kind of planned interference by a foreign national in Canadian elections.

Mercury square Pluto, indeed.

same bs waybread - the same bs that i associate with you... thanks, but no thanks..

This isn't my forum area to moderate but I am locking this thread. Please remember to try to be respectful of one another in the forums. There is a competitive Mars-Jupiter opp currently that is bringing disagreements between people.