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Native/Transit/Mundane Chart of London or UK for 7.7.2005...
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LittleMermaid



Joined: 09 Apr 2005
Posts: 40

Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 7:56 am    Post subject: Native/Transit/Mundane Chart of London or UK for 7.7.2005... Reply with quote

Good morning to everyone,

I know that perhaps this is not the best time to bring in subject like this right now Confused - but I hope the astrologers will understand:

Does the native/transit/mundane chart of London or the UK reflect anything more alarming which might indicate the yesterday's tragic bombings in the city Confused ?

May G-d protect us,
LittleMermaid Shocked Sad .
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Deb
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Joined: 11 Oct 2003
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Location: England

Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is an astrology site, and so of course members will wish to analyse the astrological factors of these events.

Below is a chart for the first blast – I have heard conflicting reports of the time for this according to BBC, ITV or radio coverage – some have said 8:49 am, but mostly it is now reported as 8:51 am.

This chart is immediately expressive but I’m going to look at it more closely at another time. I’ve also included a copy of the UK national chart for 1801. The action around the Moon in both charts is striking.

For some time posts have been referring to this period as noticeably difficult. I see that in the Dangerous configurations for July thread, Kirk mentioned July 6-18, 2005 as a period worth checking against the charts of nations and leaders.



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kurgal



Joined: 04 Jan 2005
Posts: 197
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 5:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the event chart, my attention was immediately drawn to the 9th House Mars: the aggression/danger emanates from a foreign group or foreign land....and this Mars (dignified and strong) squares the Sun, the ascendant ruler....

Mars in Aries in the 9th (and ruling the 9th) is also apt symbolism for very aggressive religious or ideaological fanaticism.

And just noticed another thing: Mars rules the 9th AND the 4th House...tying together the meanings of these two houses: Mars, the terrorist group, is foreign (9th) but operating or having a strong base, presence, or foundation on domestic (English) soil (4th).

I'm sure there's a lot more to discover in this chart though.
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Deb
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Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

An update on the timing for those who live outside the UK and may not be aware of this.

Initial reports were that the three explosions on the underground occurred at different times, but it is now established that they all occurred within 50 seconds of 8:50 am (BST).

The BBC website reports:
Quote:
Three bombs went off almost simultaneously at about 0850 on Underground trains just outside Liverpool Street and Edgware Road stations, and on another travelling between King's Cross and Russell Square.
The final explosion was on a double-decker bus.


The explosion on the bus - number 30, travelling from Hackney to Marble Arch, occurred at 9:47 am
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kurgal



Joined: 04 Jan 2005
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Location: Auckland, New Zealand

Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 7:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Further to what I said above.....just heard on the news tonight that all the bombers are believed to be British Nationals, although mastermind could be based overseas....
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hel141



Joined: 21 Jun 2005
Posts: 4

Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

I am a complete beginner, so please forgive me if I get this wrong:

Quote:
Further to what I said above.....just heard on the news tonight that all the bombers are believed to be British Nationals, although mastermind could be based overseas....


Does Pluto in Sag in the 4th represent this? I originally saw Pluto here as " a 'religious/foreign' (sag) bomb (pluto) buried deep underground (4th Sco)". (Total beginner.) Or someone who was obsessed with religion and wanted to undermine our, for want of a better word, heritage. I think the Mars/Jup Opp does suggest foreigners wanting to upset the religious balance, though.

I totally agree there is more to this chart than first appears. It seems to be more multi-level than most.

Thanks

hel
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amelia



Joined: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 397
Location: Wales

Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the event chart I would have taken the 12th house to represent the terrorists - as a hidden enemy. The sun rules the 12th and also rules the 1st. The sun is also in cancer. Cancer suggested to me that they are "from home" or nationals and the shared rulership of 12th and 1st also suggested to me that the enemy is from "within"- on thinking about it again now maybe it also indicates that they shared the same fate as those they attacked.

I read the mars in 9th to just be the religous fanaticism.

I did a horary earlier in the week on "where are the terrorists" but won't publish it as it is a mundane horary.
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Sungem



Joined: 27 Feb 2005
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Location: Australia

Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 4:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I went to an astrology meeting last night where we were going to look at this but someone had brought an Al Quaeda chart instead of the London chart. Confused However it made me think about this UK one.

Is the chart for London the same as the UK chart above Deb? If they are different, would the London one be more specific?
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###



Joined: 08 Jul 2004
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Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I ‘m still drawn to Mars at home in Cardinal Aries square the Sun in Cardinal Cancer. In Cardinal signs there is a strong push—something needs to move, something must happen, something must begin. When the Sun entered Cancer Mars was at 7 Aries. Two hot planets, one the domicile ruler and one the exaltation ruler of Aries, slowly applied to a tense aspect in Cardinal signs. We tend to want to look for grand configurations and outer planet activity that will wow us. We take a Sun-Mars square for granted as rather minor and somewhat uninteresting. However, the fact that the relatively fast-moving Sun and Mars in Cardinal signs were gradually moving into a tense aspect is, I think, easily overlooked. However, once the Sun entered Cancer in June there was already an applying in-sign square and that square took three weeks to complete. This is what caught my attention and led to my comments in the ‘Dangerous Configurations for July’ thread. The Sun and Mars may not show us major trends, but they do seem able to set in motion things which are on some minds. The slow build-up of the Cardinal square struck me as brewing tension which needed, and was looking for, release.

Concerning the outer planets, Neptune may have added a smoke-screen to the activity to Mars by way of the sextile, but the emphasis to me is still with Mars at home in Aries and tired of waiting.

And then there are the Moon’s nodes...It’s often hard to know what to do with them, isn’t it? Looking at the UK national chart and this event chart they are too connected to the event to ignore.
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Sungem



Joined: 27 Feb 2005
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Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
And then there are the Moon’s nodes...It’s often hard to know what to do with them, isn’t it? Looking at the UK national chart and this event chart they are too connected to the event to ignore.


It has just occurred to me that the solar eclipse on 8 April at 19.06 Aries was partile square the UK Moon. While I have only just started looking at eclipses and don't really know much about their application - this seems a bit uncanny and may have been an added "trigger" aspect.
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Deb
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Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with you Kirk – Mars is often overlooked in favour of the outer planets in these types of charts, yet it is a key planet in any event motivated by anger or designed to cause damage to an ‘enemy’.

In this chart Mars is conjunct the north node. We have the Sun applying to Mars by square, and the Moon separating from Mars by square (besieged as it next applies to the conjunction of Saturn).

A lot of astrologers noticed this Sun-Mars (on the node) square and decided that the period around it would be difficult; some suggesting the 11th July would be the most difficult day of the year. We always make the mistake of overlooking the Moon’s importance in bringing the energy of difficult aspects into manifestation. The Moon is more important in timing than any other planet, so we should have expected the tension of the Sun-Mars square to become released as the Moon contacted Mars.

It is worth comparing this chart with that of other terrorist attacks, such as the Madrid train bombings and the chart for the September 11th attack (09/11/01 8:46 am EDT NY)

In the chart for 9/11 the Moon at 28 Gemini is applying directly to the opposition of Mars at 1 Capricorn (Mars is conjunct the South node in this chart, at 03 Capricorn.)

In the chart for the Madrid bombings, the Moon at 16.46 Scorpio is separating from the South node and applying directly to the opposition of Mars at 23. 34 Taurus (conjunct Algol).

Also, the Bali Bombings (12/10/02 – Denpassar, Indonesia, 11.05 pm (-7 hrs)) occurred with Mars and Saturn within less than 1 degree of a mutually applying square, as the Moon hit the descendant and was applying to the square of the Sun and then to the trine of Mars.

I’m sure Uranus contributes to the shock factor and potential for destruction of these events, but we can see that they tend to happen when Mars is highlighted or unfortunate and being contacted by the Moon.

A couple of other points, I wouldn’t dismiss the 7th house in favour of the 12th for the terrorists (a hidden enemy). The 7th house is the destructive angle associated with enemies, fugitives and those that attack us. But the placement of the 7th house ruler on the 12th house cusp is descriptive of the clandestine nature of their attack.

In this and the other terrorist attack charts discussed above, the Moon is making an application to the ruler of the 7th house in all instances except the Bali bombings, where the Moon is actually on the 7th house. Also, in all charts the 7th house ruler is either Mars or if not, it aspects Mars by a major aspect.




With regard to Pluto at 22.35 Sag – it is worth noting that yesterday’s papers reproduced the birth certificate of Shehzad Tanweer, the 22 yr old suicide bomber of the Aldgate attack. He was born in Bradford on 15 Dec 1982. His Sun is at 23 Sag, his Neptune is at 26 Sag, and the noon chart for his date of birth shows the Moon at 24 Sag. His Sun, Moon and Neptune conjunction show an intense, idealistic and impressionable young man. The Pluto transit was hovering over his Sun earlier in the year when he went to Pakistan to study religion.

Sungem – I prefer the 1801 chart because of connections like this. When we had the King’s Cross fire in 1987, the preceding eclipse was at 13 Aries-Libra, which hit the nodal axis of the 1801 chart.

It might be a good exercise to look at the next solar eclipse at 21 Libra, and start considering which national charts show sensitivity around that degree.
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yuzuru



Joined: 01 Apr 2005
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Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 9:39 pm    Post subject: Mistake ? Reply with quote

I think there is a little mistake in Deb´s post... The eclipse isn~t in 21 Libra.
3/10/05 eclipse ub 10Libra
17/10/05 eclipse in 24Libra

I am doing a study for the dangerour configurations in november, december, but there is soooo many factor for a poor astrologer :-(

I think Deb should distribute work for the people in the forum, everyone get a country or a lunation, what do you think ? Leery

Yuzuru
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Sue



Joined: 11 Oct 2003
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Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2005 1:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with Kirk and Deb that Mars is so important in these charts. It is also true with most charts involving large loss of life due to accident or natural disasters. As I have mentioned before, I have looked at rail accident charts on and off for a couple of years and discovered that Mars is almost always involved in a significant way. In these charts, the Moon and Mars are in Ptolemaic aspect in almost 70% of cases. It is similar with Sun/Mars. What I found interesting though, is that it is the so-called easy aspects that are the most common. Although I was taught many years ago that the easy aspects are good aspects, it makes a lot of sense that these aspects, i.e. sextile and trine, can bring easy facilitation of such disasters and that they predominate in these charts.

On the upcoming solar eclipse, I just looked at Solar Maps and the eclipse goes right through Madrid and through North African countries, Tunisia, Sudan, Libya and Kenya. The eclipse is conjunct Pluto in the 1975 chart for Spain.

Quote:
In this and the other terrorist attack charts discussed above, the Moon is making an application to the ruler of the 7th house in all instances except the Bali bombings, where the Moon is actually on the 7th house. Also, in all charts the 7th house ruler is either Mars or if not, it aspects Mars by a major aspect.


That is very interesting indeed. I'd like to look into that further with other charts. So much to do and so little time...... Sad
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kurgal



Joined: 04 Jan 2005
Posts: 197
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2005 2:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Kirk makes a good point about the Sun/Mars square happening in Cardinal signs. These are very action-orientated. (That quality is sometimes overlooked with seemingly "passive" signs like Cancer and Libra). Planets in Cardinal signs are powerful and arguably more likely to trigger/cause some result in the material world than, say, the same planetary configuration happening in Mutable or Fixed signs.
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kurgal



Joined: 04 Jan 2005
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Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2005 3:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I find it interesting that several of us have reached the same conclusion about this terrorist operation having strong national/British roots, but through different approaches:

Quote:
In the event chart I would have taken the 12th house to represent the terrorists - as a hidden enemy. The sun rules the 12th and also rules the 1st. The sun is also in cancer. Cancer suggested to me that they are "from home" or nationals....


Quote:
And just noticed another thing: Mars rules the 9th AND the 4th House...tying together the meanings of these two houses: Mars, the terrorist group, is foreign (9th) but operating or having a strong base, presence, or foundation on domestic (English) soil (4th).


Quote:
Does Pluto in Sag in the 4th represent this? I originally saw Pluto here as " a 'religious/foreign' (sag) bomb (pluto) buried deep underground (4th Sco)". (Total beginner.) Or someone who was obsessed with religion and wanted to undermine our, for want of a better word, heritage.


It seems that Mars in Aries in the 9th ruling the 4th; Pluto in Sagittarius in the 4th; and possibly the Sun in Cancer; are factors which all point to a threat based firmly at "home" but also containing a foreign/religious element.

Another good example of the same "message" or theme being repeated in a chart, albeit through different symbolism, and in different ways.
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