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Pluto in Capricorn
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Fleur



Joined: 05 Feb 2014
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Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 7:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are massive similarities between when Neptune was in Capricorn and now when Pluto is in Capricorn. I think the mundane phenomena we are seeing are Capricorn rather than just Pluto.

Tony Blair was widely supported in the mid 1990's when he came to power, with Neptune in Capricorn, similarly Obama with Pluto in Capricorn.

I could go on, but won't. I agree with Tanit and Modwasp a lot.
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Tanit3333



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Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Pluto's symbolism is of a profound nature because of the length of it's orbit. The influence is generational. One can't think of Pluto in terms of transits.


I was actually thinking of Pluto in Capricorn in terms of energy in general, but it certainly can be a transit influence. Capricorn is a sign of Saturn. It is not expansive, thus, it is restrictive, and the sign originates from periods of winter that are most unpredictable. All of the cardinal signs represent periods of the season that are most up and down, and downright difficult at times, more so in winter. Even if it can show manifestations of identity/material world coming together, I believe the fish portion is only its tail, so it is not bi-corpeal like the dual signs and integrated. I am not sure where you are getting the idea about transhumanism and transgender movements because to me the energy of this influence combined (not just Capricorn) is not easy, but maybe you see something of the influence I don't. If anything, I would think this influence could hinder such things, although Pluto can sometimes break down influences of the sign it is in. Pluto also deals with matters of power that supports us (finances, water/food resources, etc.), and Capricorn also deals with crops and the land, which is not profound, it just is - planets are not always profound, they sometimes just represent symbols of things that occur. I think this influence will show resources more scarce and I already see the implications of difficulties in antibiotic treatment coming based on decisions made now (us scientists are seeing a post antibiotic era on the rise). Climate change is also screaming in our faces yet people in power turn a deaf ear - hopefully this influence will force extreme changes in our ways of living, if it isn't too late. Those born during the period will likely deal with this more than any of us, though, so yes, it is also generational.

Personally, I am a cynic and don't see 16 years being enough time for humans to evolve much, and more often than not humanity disappoints me. I often hear about some sort of awakening happening at this or that time but I still hold to Kurt Vonnegut's idea that humanity is suicidal (as funny as it may sound, in some ways it seems true).

The US has Pluto in Capricorn, so it went through a return also.
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james_m



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Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 3:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tanit,

depending on what chart is used for usa, the usa is 'going thru' a pluto return in this vicinity of time... it looks like it is walking towards the edge of a cliff as i read it.. so many the death and transformation part hasn't happened yet.. if you go with a later date for the usa, the 1789 potusa chart has pluto 19 aquarius... many of the other charts centered around 1776 have pluto at 27 cap...
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zoidsoft



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Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 4:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

james_m wrote:
...so many the death and transformation part hasn't happened yet.. if you go with a later date for the usa, the 1789 potusa chart has pluto 19 aquarius... many of the other charts centered around 1776 have pluto at 27 cap...


It's quite clear that most of the fallout from this configuration is in the future, not the past. The politics is controlled by the money, not the other way around. So forget the vote, and identity politics. Astrologers who focus on these aren't seeing with enough depth the machinery of empire.

The SEC is currently setting a legal precedent with smaller crypto ICO entities who failed the decentralization test (aka - not anonymous like Satoshi Nakamoto and located under its jurisdiction). These smaller entities aren't fighting the SEC because the fines are small. It's a strategy they use so that by the time they get to the big fish, they have several precedent setting cases which makes it easier to bring the big fish into line.

This video by Andreas Antonopoulos lays out what is happening that's not being reported by the MSM (and why)...

https://youtu.be/LgI0liAee4s

He's far from the only one talking about this. The cat's out of the bag now...

[url]https://d.tube/#!/v/dollarvigilante/elrtdnc5[/url]

This message is spreading fast, but platforms like FB, Twitter, etc are censoring anyone who speaks of this. This is why you haven't seen me on either of these platforms.

Pluto in Capricorn seems to be the opposite of "trust". When bitcoin was born, it was introduced as a "trustless" protocol. It has a symbolism in that regard that is traditionally opposite to the significations of Mercury.

Basically up until 2009, national fiat had a monopoly, and trust was necessary (as well as the inevitable violations of that trust). But the Byzantine generals problem was solved without the use of central authority for the first time in history. Now there's a virtual exit and borders are being erected (this was key the last two times Saturn was in Capricorn). I believe the Sibley chart has Mercury at 27 Cancer. So, I'm expecting that Pluto represents the inability of Saturn to secure its borders and control the money flow which will likely come into focus when Pluto opposes this Mercury. Jupiter follows around the same time and the Jupiter/Saturn conjunction is common for economic and generational "resets".

Now that the Federal Reserve has competition from the "internet of money", who will win? Well, Blockstream seems to be reticent to implement privacy technology in bitcoin, while some others are going ahead. This will probably be followed by violence from those wearing a badge to uphold the edicts of the state. This of course is nothing new. But what is new is that the Fed is finally in over its head with the jurisdiction of internet finance. Other governments will not agree and Tim Draper said that this will set up the situation where other governments will compete for its "citizens". I put citizens in quotes because in the past all of these types of activity was determined by locality. This is no longer the case because the concept of "virtual citizenship" is now emerging. He is now a virtual citizen of the nation of Estonia which has adopted blockchain technology. Jeff Berwick did the same in the nation of Liberland. Tim Draper explains this here...

https://www.cryptoinvestor.show/podcasts/tim-draper-the-future-of-society?utm_source=Social&utm_medium=Twitter&utm_campaign=Podcast_Episode_1
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Tanit3333



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Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

James - that is a good point regarding the unknown placement of the US Pluto, and would explain why the return doesn't seem particularly striking yet (to me anyway).
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Fleur



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Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting article on Pluto in Capricorn that describes the historical eras with this transit.
https://cosmicintelligenceagency.com/pluto-capricorn/

The last period was 1762 to 1778. The beginning of the Industrial Revolution?

Wikipedia says the Industrial Revolution was from about 1760.
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SGFoxe



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Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We, qua astrologers, tend to forget to account for the huge cycle -- the precessional cycle as signified by the 2012 solstice as memorialized by the Mayans (hint: the Mayans astro orientation had to do with the changing relationship with the earth's axis of rotation (N/S as gyroscopically defined) and the Galactic Disk which was pierced in Astronomical Epoch 2000.0 which clocked in December 1999 -- the end of their Fifth Great Age of the cycle which began August 12, -3112. This well within partile orb of the beginning of the Kali Yuga. The tropical solstice point precesses to the degree of the Galactic Center at the next Pluto ingress Capricorn circa winter solstice 2227 AD. And to quote Bette Davis -- fasten your seatbelts, it's going to be a bumpy ride and we seem to have a posse of idiots at the helm

PS ... Curt, I think the crypto currencies are inherently illegal -- since the first act in forming a government is to establish the official and only legal medium of exchange, each dollar bill being, in essence, a government contract -- my wholesale solution is to nationalize the banks and by charging a service charge on any exchange of goods & services using the only legal medium of exchange should suffice to keep the government in business ... eg national the banks and privatize what you will, because of taking control of the means of exchange and thereby the market would theoretically support the government -- the coming Pluto/Saturn US Pluto return manifesting with the US elections ... the Mayans did predict that Bolon Yokte Kuh -- a deity representing the 9 levels of the Mayan underworld/hell -- eg pandemonium would accompany the 13th Katun ...
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zoidsoft



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Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SGFoxe wrote:
PS ... Curt, I think the crypto currencies are inherently illegal -- since the first act in forming a government is to establish the official and only legal medium of exchange, each dollar bill being, in essence, a government contract


The SEC apparently already disagrees with your statement about bitcoin as it was labeled a commodity and taxed like a stock (instead of a security), although several other governments have attempted to ban it (unsuccessfully of course).

First watch this video as I pointed out above, then lets talk about legality. Until the morality and ethics are set straight, legality is just an excuse to let the real criminals off the hook.

https://youtu.be/LgI0liAee4s

If you go back further in time than a few hundred years, your statement about government setting a medium of exchange becomes false. Aristotle spoke of the properties of money (SOV, MOE, UOA), but there's been one added since about 1970 (Nixon's Bank Secrecy Act).

https://youtu.be/FyK4P7ZdOK8

Regardless, the edicts of nation states cannot override the jurisdiction of the internet which is global. It therefore has higher rank, not by legality, but by physical reality. Of course within each nations borders, badge wearers will extract blood for compliance, but this just encourages a game of "whack a mole". Governments are quite aware of this which is why some of the brighter politicians have been holding back the idiot politicians from making fatal mistakes.

Andreas has said that this is a common reaction that statists have when confronted with this reality, and seem to think that cypherpunks are questioning their authority. We are not. We are questioning their ability. They simply won't be able to force their political will onto everyone everywhere because they don't have the ability to censor thought yet (and that's the reality behind what it will take to stop this).

https://bravenewcoin.com/insights/steganography-how-antonopoulos-hid-a-us12m-transaction-in-a-picture-of-kittens

This is because money has become speech (see Citizens United Act of 2010) and now bytes are all forms of alternate medium of exchange and value. Money has become a "content type" and as speech, censoring it is a violation of the first amendment.

PS- I'll bet that the corporate overlords who sponsored Citizens United never saw that coming.
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james_m



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Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zoidsoft wrote:

It's quite clear that most of the fallout from this configuration is in the future, not the past. The politics is controlled by the money, not the other way around.


Pluto in Capricorn seems to be the opposite of "trust".

Basically up until 2009, national fiat had a monopoly, and trust was necessary (as well as the inevitable violations of that trust). But the Byzantine generals problem was solved without the use of central authority for the first time in history. Now there's a virtual exit and borders are being erected (this was key the last two times Saturn was in Capricorn). I believe the Sibley chart has Mercury at 27 Cancer. So, I'm expecting that Pluto represents the inability of Saturn to secure its borders and control the money flow which will likely come into focus when Pluto opposes this Mercury. Jupiter follows around the same time and the Jupiter/Saturn conjunction is common for economic and generational "resets".

Now that the Federal Reserve has competition from the "internet of money", who will win?


thanks curtis.. i have spliced your post, but have kept what i wanted to highlight...

the way i see it, the world financial system is private, not public and it is controlled by private interests, not public.. any public side to it is a thin veneer to hide and keep hidden who controls it and runs it.. essentially a very small 1% or something like that, dictate to the other 99%.. they work hard to hide the true nature of finance and how it is private, not public... the federal reserve is a private bank.. yes, they have certain obligations to the usa gov't and they are controlled by the usa gov't, if you can call it that, in a hands off type way.. the whole imf, world bank, bank of international settlements and etc, are all intimately tied together as well... there is a huge amount of manipulation and hidden dynamics that most people, including myself, don't know much of anything about...

yes, i think the connection of pluto to the usa is into the future and not fully on tap just yet.. i have stated on skyscript that i believe the coincidence of the jupiter-saturn conjunction 2020 and the saturn/pluto conjunction 2020 is a very significant combo of conjunctions that is going to usher in something very different for the world and i believe it will have a lot to do with the world financial system... when one country wants to hold others hostage to international agreements that were put in place right near the end of the 2nd world war and where they hold all the power, it can't continue to work, and instead the international agreements break down.. that is what i think we are seeing and i think it is going to get more pronounced as we move forward..

as for cryptocurrencies being illegal.. laws are made by those in power.. power is indeed a pluto theme and perhaps the power of special interests - corporations - to dictate to gov'ts what they want and have their special interests served is a pluto in capricorn theme as i understand it.. we live in a world where corporations have undue power and influence over the affairs of countries thru their leverage over politicians, on an approx 4 year turn over cycle who are typically beholden to them and not the ordinary citizen... politicians know if they want to retain their position, must cater to these powerful private interests... this is pluto in cap stuff to me...

the thought that the gov't is working for corporations, as opposed to people seems pretty clear to me... laws are made to keep and retain power.. their is nothing inherently civilized about many of the laws and rules in place at this point in time in the world and this to me is also a pluto in capricorn dynamic...
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zoidsoft



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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 2:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

james_m wrote:
...i believe the coincidence of the jupiter-saturn conjunction 2020 and the saturn/pluto conjunction 2020 is a very significant combo of conjunctions that is going to usher in something very different for the world and i believe it will have a lot to do with the world financial system...


Agreed. One of the interesting patterns in bitcoin is how the halving of the block reward coincides with this event which will happen sometime again in the summer of 2020. This seemingly insignificant little technological fact was largely responsible for the 2017 bull run. This is because the halving of the block reward causes a slow down in the QE (Quantative Easing). This continual 4 year cycle follows Zeno's principle until the year 2140 when the last bitcoin is mined (capped at 21 million). QE is the reason that all national fiat either goes into hyperinflation or debt default. The financial crisis of 2008 was followed by the release of bitcoin on Jan 3, 2009 on the heels of the Pluto in Capricorn ingress. In the bitcoin genesis block one can find the cryptic statement... (right side of below hash)

00000080 01 04 45 54 68 65 20 54 69 6D 65 73 20 30 33 2F ..EThe Times 03/
00000090 4A 61 6E 2F 32 30 30 39 20 43 68 61 6E 63 65 6C Jan/2009 Chancel
000000A0 6C 6F 72 20 6F 6E 20 62 72 69 6E 6B 20 6F 66 20 lor on brink of
000000B0 73 65 63 6F 6E 64 20 62 61 69 6C 6F 75 74 20 66 second bailout f
000000C0 6F 72 20 62 61 6E 6B 73 FF FF FF FF 01 00 F2 05 or banksÿÿÿÿ..ò.

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Genesis_block

The fact that bitcoin supply cannot be manipulated by politicians or bankers is the reason that bitcoin exists and the reason for the above statement. This is critically important if one wants to have honest money.
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zoidsoft



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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Architecturally speaking, Pluto in Capricorn seems to be turning the infrastructure inside out. We now have these large hacks of centralized databases and it keeps getting worse. Last one was of 145 million records on Equifax. Now it's 500 million records of passports and credit cards from Marriott. Centralization of data (and power) is the biggest problem and 2FA can't fix it. Adding more firewalls mimics the binomial random walk (aka Gamblers Ruin) problem.

The correct way to manage this risk is through distributed databases that hash records that can be encrypted back to the source. It's a mistake to place 500 million records where the hack of a single password or a few servers gives out reams of data. If you force hackers to hack each record individually, then it becomes prohibitively expensive to do the hack without a botnet (which is much more difficult to pull off).

Pluto in Capricorn brings the message that hierarchy needs to be flattened. It is suggesting that disintermediation (the removal of middlemen to be replaced with P2P) is the impending architecture of the future that will fix the problems of a parasitic banking and information cartel.
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james_m



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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

curtis,

i do wonder when the internet will be shut down.. maybe we have to wait until pluto makes it to aquarius! it seems technology is not all it is cracked up to be, however their are more new members to the church of technology then their are to any other religion today!!! people are spending huge amounts of time and money using the internet, while also gaining different perspectives and a whole lot of propaganda too - see wikipedia for example, lol...

so, i am anticipating that the internet is going to be more modified, or controlled or shut down periodically, or certain sites will not be allowed to be seen - all for our own protection, thanks the nsa and etc, LOLOL... i think that is where we are headed and i never thought it would get to this, but i think it is going to..
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zoidsoft



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Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

james_m wrote:
curtis,

i do wonder when the internet will be shut down..


Knew this one was coming. Let me show you the problem with this line of attack. First of all, the current banking system is using the same network, so goodbye SWIFT (the protocol that the banking system uses for ACH) and similar banking wire transfer networks...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Society_for_Worldwide_Interbank_Financial_Telecommunication

To do significant shutdown of the internet will cause more problems for authority than it will solve and the banks would be cutting their own throat. The banking system will have to go back to pen and paper calculations (good luck with your derivative stock options that need to be executed accurate to the millisecond). This would just about guarantee a crash of the stock market. Look what happened in Philadelphia when the EBT network went offline for a few hours:

https://youtu.be/ncwoXwdJBVE

So, no the internet kill switch which has been bandied about by authority as an option is not an option if they want to retain control of the situation. But by all means, if you're a despot reading this, please do this and thank you for exiting your corrupt office. You'll last less than a week in power.

The more realistic approach is stealth filtering of results (shadow banning) from centralized IT sources. In fact they are already doing this...

https://steemit.com/news/@johnvibes/today-hundreds-of-activist-pages-were-purged-from-facebook-including-many-of-mine

However, when it comes to bitcoin, there are actually alternative networks outside of the internet itself. One such network is run by Blockstream Satellite:

https://blockstream.com/satellite/

There are also new mesh networks being born which disintermediates the ISP industry so despots seeking to use your ISP provider to censor your content are going to have trouble there as well.

https://www.skycoin.net
https://blockstack.org
https://substratum.net

Jared Rice is also building a decentralized internet which would be impervious to censorship...

https://medium.com/@CryptoKong123/extract-from-jared-rice-dweb-series-part-1-the-great-chain-489403b519f5

I just pointed out a couple of projects, but there's a lot more going on. This of course doesn't mean that there will not be a large section of the population content to stay slaves on FB and controlled like cattle, but that is a choice.

The bottom line is that censoring math is not realistically possible. The idiot TSA now ask if you carry bitcoin in your bags when you cross borders (LOL). They don't understand that this is impossible, but that's how the stupid bureaurats wrote the law. You can carry cryptographically signed keys and if you're technically sophisticated enough, you've memorized them. So if they make this illegal, to be in compliance with the law, everyone who has memorized their cryptographic keys will have to undergo a prefrontal lobotomy at the border. This is because bitcoin wallets are inside out: the coins are on the distributed network, locked by hashes in public cyberspace and never really go anywhere (therefore money transmission laws don't apply), but the keys can be held in your head. It's the keys that can move, not the money.

The current rulers are just dinosaurs who don't understand the new world that is emerging. The much more realistic worry is bankers buying up Blockstream and having enough influence to modify the code and buy out the miners, coopting the system in some ways or using a replacement such as FedCoin or a digital SDR which would be a centralized and fully censorable alternative. I've referred to this as a "digital panopticon" in my writings on Steemit and this is a realistic danger, especially in the west.

I don't want to take up space on this forum to discuss it here. I've written extensively on my Steemit blog over the past year or so on what is going on in this space...

https://steemit.com/@zoidsoft

Here's an important one:

https://steemit.com/bitcoin/@zoidsoft/how-occupy-wall-street-echoed-bitcoin-through-proof-of-voice-and-decentralized-consensus

Click on "hide resteems" to see what I've written on the subject. Most of my best work in this area is about a year old, so you might have to go back a ways.
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james_m



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Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 1:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

curtis,

just to use one example.. the west are tailoring SWIFT to exclude iran for example and keep it going for those '''''it''''' deems friendly... that is not the way an international system can work...

the same thing will happen with the internet.... it will be selective... certain sites and views will be allowed and others will be shut out... see twitter, facebook and etc for a good example of this... these corps have a specific ideology that they are following...

shutting down, some, but not all of the internet is definitely on the way...
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zoidsoft



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Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 1:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

james_m wrote:
curtis,

just to use one example.. the west are tailoring SWIFT to exclude iran for example and keep it going for those '''''it''''' deems friendly... that is not the way an international system can work...

the same thing will happen with the internet.... it will be selective... certain sites and views will be allowed and others will be shut out... see twitter, facebook and etc for a good example of this... these corps have a specific ideology that they are following...

shutting down, some, but not all of the internet is definitely on the way...


China is already locked down to some degree in the way you say above, but the Chinese have still found a way to invest in bitcoin. I'm not saying that it's impossible to do in the future, but that it's currently a much bigger problem than authority wants to admit. They like to appear as gods before you and don't want to admit their weaknesses. This is what I was trying to point out in my post above. A digital panopticon is indeed coming and partially already here, but it is not going to come by "shutting down the internet". That's a blunt force approach with a lot of collateral damage. So please read the rest of what I wrote about above carefully.

In any case, this is a temporary situation that I estimate will cause about a generation of pain in the west for the fools who accept authority's answer to centralized IT failings. This video will help you understand why what you are saying is impossible to sustain long term...

https://youtu.be/810aKcfM__Q
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