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When will I get the job
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Taurus7



Joined: 23 Oct 2003
Posts: 588

Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 4:59 pm    Post subject: When will I get the job Reply with quote

I was laid off from a job that I worked at for 9 years back in March of 2018. Since then, I landed a brief 4 month contract, which ended in February. I have been actively seeking employment since then, applying and sending out multiple applications every day, but there seems to be a blockage. Despite what seems like a good resume in a lucrative field, nothing seems to be coming through. I feel like I am quickly running out of steam, hope and resources. Hence, the horary?

"When will I get a job?"
Jne 1, 2019, 4:19 AM
Kinnelon, NJ 07405
17 degrees 58 minutes Taurus ASC



I am Venus, and co-significator the Moon. The Job is Saturn.

Venus, strong in it's own dignity, just past the trine with Saturn by a matter of minutes.
The Moon, in it's exaltation, sitting right at the cusp of the first house, also coming to a trine to a very dignified Saturn in it's own sign, in less than 6 degrees.

All looks good, doesn't it! If I hadn't been having the blockage I have been experiencing for so long, I would think this looks like a positive horary where I would easily land a job (trine) in a matter of 6 weeks, since the Moon is technically in the first house (the 5 degree rule). The job itself is strong in it's own sign, the money from the job is also strong (also ruled by Saturn), it's location in the 9th house perhaps indicates a job with a foreign country or involved in foreign matters.

Would appreciate feedback from others. I could use some uplift Smile

Taurus7
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Part of Fortune



Joined: 29 May 2017
Posts: 317

Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 6:11 pm    Post subject: Re: When will I get the job Reply with quote

Hello Taurus,

There's TOL between the Moon, Saturn and Venus. So yes, I would say you will get a job ruled by Saturn.

As for the timing, it could be in 6 weeks or it might take a while (possibly more than 6 weeks) because of fixed sign at the angle (the Moon and Venus in Taurus) also Saturn is in a movable sign but retrograde and in cadent house.

Anthony Louis listed as weeks (method 1) and also months (method 2). Lee Lehman listed as months.
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Part of Fortune



Joined: 29 May 2017
Posts: 317

Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 6:34 pm    Post subject: Re: When will I get the job Reply with quote

Part of Fortune wrote:
Hello Taurus,

There's TOL between the Moon, Saturn and Venus. So yes, I would say you will get a job ruled by Saturn.

As for the timing, it could be in 6 weeks or it might take a while (possibly more than 6 weeks) because of fixed sign at the angle (the Moon and Venus in Taurus) also Saturn is in a movable sign but retrograde and in cadent house.

Anthony Louis listed as weeks (method 1) and also months (method 2). Lee Lehman listed as months.



Taurus, I'm troubled about Neptune --
It is placed between the Moon and Saturn in your 11th house of hopes and wishes (and forum)... perhaps Neptune is just indicating some confusion (caused by me) Embarassed
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
Posts: 760

Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2019 4:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Taurus - it sounds like you are going through a difficult period. I wonder if you are in Saturn profection years and/or having difficult Saturn transits. Note here that Saturn also rules the 10th house, showing difficulty in that area. I have gone through some difficult Saturn years via profections and Saturn return and came out of it having learned a lot but they were periods of extreme hardship, and as you called it, a blockage. It was a very humbling experience. Robert Hand in his texts always says to to basically do what you have been doing - work your hardest to improve matters (and don't try old methods that do not work). It can be a time where you get rid of many things in your life in general that are just not working right and restructure your goals and life, basically. That is assuming this is a Saturn issue but it sure sounds like the symptoms of it.

The retro movement can show going back to an old position, maybe? What is your interpretation of this? I have discussed significators applying to retro planets in a few other posts recently and the outcome can vary considerably from the querent changing their mind to the matter not coming of anything, or just revisiting something. My main worry though is that the Moon is technically besieged, which is when the Moon goes from one difficult situation to another. I am not sure why I have seen so much besiegment lately but in your case there is some positive stuff that might help alleviate it, such as the L1 and Moon so strongly placed. Still, with fixed signs abundant and a retro 10th ruler and it being Saturn suggests some significant delay. Since you have already experienced delay, hopefully it is just showing that. I have had positive experiences with Saturn lording 10th house matters (in transit, horary and event of a job basically) but it came with a mixed bag. I worked at a stable job for 5 years and learned a lot (Saturn tends to rule wisdom and stability) but it wasn't a pleasant experience on a lot of levels and I ended up leaving due to feeling a bit oppressed. I actually left right after Saturn transited over my natal Moon and I grew tired of feeling unhappy there. Hopefully if Saturn is representing an opportunity that it does not come with mixed blessings. Often that is the nature of malefics. They carry both good and bad typically. Saturn at night is a little more difficult though. It might be helpful for you to look into your natal influences to see what might be going on there (I don't mean sharing it with the forum but in general trying to see if it gives you a better idea of when things will improve). If it is a Saturn issue, they often last about 2 years. The 5 degree aspect here might be describing months from fixed signs but whenever Saturn is involved I have a hard time taking degree aspects as very reliable. It usually means to expect nothing will come without effort, and to expect hardship and delay. Luckily, when L1 and Moon are strongly placed, it generally means the querent has control over how the outcome turns out, meaning with hard work you should see results (although, again with difficulty and probably with around equal happiness and disappointment, at least for what is asked about - your next job).

Since the 7th ruler is afflicted and L1 is strong, my guess is your own judgment on the matter will be more accurate than the forum. Good luck and keep us posted.
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Taurus7



Joined: 23 Oct 2003
Posts: 588

Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 11:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Part of Fortune:
Quote:
There's TOL between the Moon, Saturn and Venus

I think for TOL to take place, the Moon has to separate from the querent and then aspect the quesited. I'm not sure I see the TOL?
I see your point about Neptune... Sad

Tanit:
Quote:
it sounds like you are going through a difficult period. I wonder if you are in Saturn profection years and/or having difficult Saturn transits.


Quote:
The retro movement can show going back to an old position, maybe? What is your interpretation of this?


Tanit,
I am going through a pretty rough patch. Getting laid off is part of corporate america, and I have come to accept it. But it's never easy. And it becomes more difficult as you get older. You cannot imagine the sleepless nights I continue to struggle through, wondering why things are not working out. Regarding my natal chart and transits, right now I have Uranus exactly conjuncting my Sun, which is conjunct my Midheaven. In addition to this, I have Uranus conjuncting my MC in my solar return, which was activated April 25th.

Historically, when I have had Uranus conjuncting my MC, or at least the last time this happened, I got a job with a major financial firm in NYC, and it was one of the most challenging assignments and progressive jobs I have ever had. It was very exciting and exceptionally challenging, I learned a lot, and it looked really good on my resume.

Based on some research about aspects to retro planets, Abu Mashar and Bonnatti state that if a planet is retro, regardless of whether it is the querent or quesited, the planet throws the light back to the planet aspecting it. So Saturn is not "responding", so to speak, to the trine being thrown by the Moon.
However, they also go on to say that it is better if the planet that is retro is the quesited, and if the querent is strong - which luckily it is - the light that is thrown back to the querent is able to be retained and passed on to the NEXT planet the querent applies to, which in this case is Venus, which is my significator, and the Moon is the triplicity ruler of the 10th, so it has strength in the 10th.
Summarizing, the Moon throws a trine to Saturn ruler of the 10th, which is thrown back to the Moon (blockage) because Saturn is retrograde. However, since the Moon is so strong, it is able to retain the light and gives it to Venus, myself. Since the Moon is the triplicity ruler of the 10th, this connects the Moon to the Venus and the question asked. Since the Moon also rules the passage of events - and hopefully not wishful thinking - it still gives some hope.

I got a few leads today, which may or may not work out, but the salary offering is such that I would be taking a major pay cut if any of those opportunities were to work out. Maybe that is the compromise you speak of.

What do you think?

Thanks very much.
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Part of Fortune



Joined: 29 May 2017
Posts: 317

Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 2:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taurus7 wrote:
Part of Fortune:
Quote:
There's TOL between the Moon, Saturn and Venus

I think for TOL to take place, the Moon has to separate from the querent and then aspect the quesited. I'm not sure I see the TOL?


Really? OK, let's ask Tanit.

Regarding Saturn retrograde, I was wondering ... you mentioned that you have been actively seeking employment and sending out multiple applications every day. Saturn Rx could be a revisit. Perhaps one of the places you already sent a CV to or had an interview with in the past might be contacting you in the future?
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
Posts: 760

Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 6:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To me Mars is trouble in the chart. Moon does carry the light of Mars to Saturn (a translation of light) but I would not view that as good here, especially since Mars is received by Moon rather than it receiving Moon because this means Mars is more afflictive to the querent and is an example of what I just explained to Jupiterrising - that separating aspects can influence a matter. Again, it is a placement of besiegment and shows that although Moon is well placed, it carries the energy of a difficult Mars (in fall) into the energy of Saturn retro and gives that light to it, showing that although Moon is exalted it is still carrying the nature of a debilitated malefic into the matter. Mars probably is representing being laid off previously and that future employers are influenced by this fact (since employers make stupid judgments about people who no longer have a job). Mars is also applying to oppose Saturn and in general in charts where the malefics "combine" in hard aspect, it suggests some difficulty around the matter, although luckily both are cadent and the L1/Moon are strong. Mars does receive Saturn in the opposition aspect, which at least helps make it less afflictive to the desired matter (10th ruler), as well as the fact that the opposition is prohibited by the Moon, showing the querent likely overcoming adversity. Sometimes the 7th ruler can also represent competition in job opportunities.

Deb's article on perfection with retro significators does leave some open-ended interpretations to what it could signify and not all possible choices are bad, I agree, but in traditional text Saturn retro in the 1st is quite difficult so a primary sig applying to it I would think is pretty similar. Hopefully the Saturn retro movement will not lead to lack of perfection - that seems highly unlikely on a logical level since most people are not unemployed indefinitely. It certainly should suggest extra difficulty but that does not sound unexpected.

I am guessing Saturn retro would signify extra effort and maybe going through a job/s (Saturn is cardinal) that is/are not 100% great before finding something right. I personally think Saturn represents in part the process to figure out more specifically what we are better at doing and what we want to do by challenging us as much as possible and learning from struggle (or sometimes even downright failure). Note too it is conjunct Pluto here, the planet of transformation. According to Paulus, Saturn at night also shows less clarity/knowledge/experience around the matter, so there can be more confusion and feeling lost about goals - maybe this process of unemployment might help clarify what career is best for you. In natal charts, dignified Saturn lording the 10th can show a slow rise to the top but people usually are successful, and I would think horary is similar.
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Serene



Joined: 24 Jul 2017
Posts: 202

Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Tauras. Sorry to hear that you are going through a rough patch career wise.
Most of what I'm saying must have been covered already. I see the moon and Venus strong.

Saturn, your career on malefic South node bringing you down emotionally in detriment of the moon. The ToL as well as the Moon Saturn aspect should get you the job in I'm guessing 5 to 6 months most probably with the moon angular but in a fixed sign.

My second guess would be 5-6 weeks.

But I hope you get it even sooner.
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Taurus7



Joined: 23 Oct 2003
Posts: 588

Posted: Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The astrological transits are looking positive so I'm hoping it's 6 weeks, not months. Let's see how it goes.
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Part of Fortune



Joined: 29 May 2017
Posts: 317

Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taurus7 wrote:
The Moon rules the 4rth, the end of the matter, and Mars rules the 7th (my competition) and my 12th (my undoing....), while Saturn rules the employer.

Hate to sound so pessimistic but trying to be realistic. Seems like the end of the matter is the Moon taking the light of my competition to the job, so maybe I'll never get a job again....!

So what good is Venus being so strong , and the Moon being exalted, and a wonderful trine aspect to the quesited when it all looks so bleak....

(My apologies...hitting a bit of a low day so being remarkably pessimistic....)



Hi Taurus and all,

You all might not agree with me, but this is what I see (or I wanted to see):

1) The Moon will first try to take the light of Mars to Saturn but before the perfection it will be prohibited by Neptune. This will prevent your competitor’s getting the job.

I know, I know… we don’t usually use Neptune in translation/collection cases. However, I’m talking about Neptune as the blocker (because, at the moment, the planet is very strong) and not Neptune trying to translate its light to others. Also, recently I have seen some charts where Neptune brings surprising results – they usually turned out to be positive for the querents (if querents have dignities stronger than their opponents and the Moon receives querent). In this chart, Neptune is very active and placed in 11th house (very impressive). It could be indicating things going on in the forum (I mentioned earlier that confusion could be coming from me) or indicating the querent’s hopes and wishes. By the way Taurus, 12th house is 29* Pisces 52’ so it is not ruled by Mars (as I said, Neptune might have something to do with confusion within the forum).

2) This time the Moon takes light of Saturn and gives it to Venus with mutual reception. So, this is the TOL you and I were talking about. I found two examples of TOL in which the querent and the quesited are placed ahead of the Moon. Here is one of the examples from Lee Lehman’s The Martial Art of Horary Astrology (p216):

Lehman wrote:
“The querent wanted to buy a restaurant that he had seen, so he asked whether it would be a profitable investment.”

(Here are the players)
Jupiter is at 10 Gemini 35’ (placed in 7th house) represents the querent (buyer).
Mercury is at 02 Libra 54’ (placed in 10th house) represents the quesited (seller).
The Moon is at 01 Aquarius 08’ 59” and conjunct Neptune Rx at 04 Aquarius 07’ they are placed in 2nd house.
(Actually, Neptune is conjunct 3rd house cusp which is 06 Aquarius 52” so it is technically in 3rd house).

Lehman wrote:
“The Moon is also translating the light between buyer and seller. But notice that both the perfection and the translation involve the Moon or Mercury first passing through Neptune. Not a good omen in a property sale!”

Taurus7 wrote:

Would appreciate feedback from others. I could use some uplift Very Happy


As you have said, Taurus, I am trying to find positive things in the chart to cheer you up. Take care.
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
Posts: 760

Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PoF - I am sorry, I read your earlier post wrong. I thought you were talking about TOL with Mars and Saturn. You are saying Moon translates light of Saturn to Venus? That would only be true if Moon were separating from Saturn and applying to Venus. It is applying to Saturn and separating from Mars. Venus is after it aspects Saturn, so it is not quite as relevant in the mix of aspects for TOL.

Lehman's example is not a traditional usage of TOL. Normally you either have a third heavier planet that already received aspect of a lighter significator, and this heavier planet will next be the lighter planet and have applying aspect to a heavier significator. Or you have a light planet translating the light of a past aspect with a heavier planet to another heavier significator. I have never heard of TOL involving applying aspects only. That is just an applying aspect that leads to perfection. In her chart, Moon is applying to Mercury and then Jupiter, but Mercury is also then applying to Jupiter. If she argues Moon is translating light from Mercury to Juptier, you could argue Mercury is translating light of Moon to Jupiter. I am sorry, but I disagree with this redundant meaning of TOL when it is just perfection via Moon to the querent. Moon applying to trine L1 is generally pretty favorable and can represent the matter itself and both of those also applying to the desired thing after that is favorable. Maybe there is some sort of traditional text she is basing this on but it would be unconventional.

One major difference in her example (besides the fact that she was not dealing with malefics) is no mention of Moon separating from anything also, in which case it would translate that aspect to Mercury. Here Moon is separating from a planet, Mars, and is translating that light to Saturn in this chart. Keep in mind that the separating planet Moon is carrying light of is very important regarding the energy Moon is bringing within the question. Moon is going to Saturn as if it were Mars, basically (this is more so true for Moon and Mercury, as more changeful planets based on their quick speed - they are more easily influenced by other planets):

Quote:
Lilly writes of translation (CA., p.111)

Translation of light and nature is, when a light Planet separates from a more weighty one, and presently joins to another more heavy; and its in this manner, Let Saturn be in 20. degree. of Aries: Mars in 15 of Aries, and Mercury in 16 of Aries; here Mercury being a swift Planet separates from Mars, and translates the virtue of Mars unto Saturn. Its done also as well by any Aspect as by Conjunction. And the meaning hereof in judgment, is no more then thus; That if the matter or thing were promised by Saturn, then such a man as is signified by Mercury shall procure all the assistance a Mars man can do unto Saturn, whereby the business may be the better effected; in Marriages, Lawsuits, and indeed in all vulgar questions Translation, is of great use, and ought well to be considered.


One thing Lilly does not mention is that Mercury is besieged, but my guess is that in his case Mars in Aries dignified is such a strong influence and receives Mercury that it does not matter. As I mentioned, in the chart here we have a problem because Mars is in fall and does not receive Moon. But, again, the querent and Moon are quite strong and should overcome that.
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Part of Fortune



Joined: 29 May 2017
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Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Tanit. Well, I tried... (it already passed my bedtime). Good night! Very Happy
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
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Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PoF - I think we at least agree there are some positives in the chart. I am not great with timing in horary. I usually look at natal with horary for timing when I am considering certain areas, such as work, romance, etc. For example, when my best friend had marriage issues recently, I saw specific things coming but didn't know when until I looked at her husband's natal (and that proved to help with timing). I ultimately think horary gives you a good idea of whether something will take a while or be quick but isn't always fantastic at giving specific dates, or at least I don't always see it (sometimes it does though).
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Taurus7



Joined: 23 Oct 2003
Posts: 588

Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2019 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tanit:
Quote:
The retro movement can show going back to an old position, maybe? What is your interpretation of this? I have discussed significators applying to retro planets in a few other posts recently and the outcome can vary considerably from the querent changing their mind to the matter not coming of anything, or just revisiting something.


PoF:
Quote:
you mentioned that you have been actively seeking employment and sending out multiple applications every day. Saturn Rx could be a revisit
.

An update on the current situation.
I interviewed with a company last Thursday that I used to work for back in 2000! I think the interview went well, but I did not have some of the experience they were looking for. While they seemed quite interested, and asked me questions if I was available to start work right away, and would I be OK with the commute (which seemed very positive indications), they did say they were interviewing other people. I will find out next week.
So here's a few things that come to mind in terms of the job I interviewed with, and the horary.

1) The significator of the job is retrograde. While this would not be going back to an old position, it would be going back to a company that I used to work for.


Serene:
Quote:
Saturn, your career on malefic South node bringing you down emotionally in detriment of the moon. The ToL as well as the Moon Saturn aspect should get you the job in I'm guessing 5 to 6 months most probably with the moon angular but in a fixed sign.
My second guess would be 5-6 weeks.



2) The timing. There is a 5 degree aspect between the Moon and the quesited Saturn. If I was to get this job, I would find out probably early next week - week 3 1/2 from the time the question was asked. The offer would be subject to a drug test and background check, which will take another week and a half, and once this is cleared, this would bring me up to exactly 5 weeks - of course, IF I get the offer. But I do find the timing of it to be somewhat intriguing.

3) The return of light from the Moon to the quesited, since it is retrograde. As per my earlier post, according to the ancients, the light is returned to the Moon, but the Moon is strong enough to carry it to the next planet, which is a conjunction to Venus, my significator. So the Moon is taking the returned light from Saturn to my significator. Moon is the end of the matter, and conjunction to Venus, which is also very strong in its own sign, indicates to me a favorable conclusion to the matter. In another post on this forum (titled "Return of Light") the return of light was determined by a horary with known outcome and perfected on the second try.

So regarding this particular job, what is I think of note is that the recruiter who found me this position actually submitted my resume to two other positions with the same company two days before she submitted my resume to the third position, which is the one I was interviewed for. I did not have the skills they were looking for the 3rd position, yet this was the one I heard back from. I was probably rejected for the 2 other positions, since the recruiter did not hear back from the hiring manager for them. So their request to meet with me for the 3rd position was very unexpected and came as quite a surprise! So to my point, the success on the 2nd - or 3rd try - the return of light - would make sense.

4) The money is good, the position is excellent, and the people I interviewed with were really nice. Notice that the ruler of the 11th - turned 2nd from the 10th; resources of the 10th; is also Saturn which is very strong in its own sign. Also notice that my resources are also very strong, for what it's worth - ruled by Mercury in dignity in its own sign. The only thing is it's about 42 miles from my house, but that is a small consideration, and it's normal to commute about 35 miles at least in the state I live in.

Quote:
I am guessing Saturn retro would signify extra effort and maybe going through a job/s (Saturn is cardinal) that is/are not 100% great before finding something right.

To this point, I have been trying my best to make something happen, lot of effort - more psychological I think than anything else. I was contacted by recruiters for a few other jobs, but the salary was low or the position was not what I really wanted, really quite depressing - definitely not great. I never got to interview for any of those positions anyway, but I'm thinking my "reluctant energy" for those positions kind of sub-consciously resulted in none of them working out.

This is the only one that came through, to my surprise and very unexpectedly. This job feels just right!

And one last thing - Saturn conjunct Pluto. The experience being offered by this job would be transformational / practically life- changing to the remainder of my career.

This is a big pharma company, in the healthcare industry, where they focus on inventing new medicines - It is a mature company. Saturn in Aquarius?

PoF:
Quote:
As you have said, Taurus, I am trying to find positive things in the chart to cheer you up. Take care.


That's really kind of you, thank you!

Of course, I may be trying to retro-fit everything so I might be wishful-thinking the whole thing.



What do you think?

Thanks!
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
Posts: 760

Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2019 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The significator of the job is retrograde. While this would not be going back to an old position, it would be going back to a company that I used to work for


There would be no way to tell the difference between the nuance here. Horary charts are fairly simplistic. In what way would a chart show a retro planet going back to an employer versus the position? The employer and job are ruled by the same house. Maybe the quality of a position could be different versus your old one. Here the position is described as Saturn in Capricorn. Does this describe the position to you? I normally think of regulatory work, government, etc.

Congrats on the interview going well! Best of luck to you and I hope you get the job.
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