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The Khullar Astrological System
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Therese Hamilton



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Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 9:26 pm    Post subject: The Khullar Astrological System Reply with quote

Introduction to S.P. Khullar’s Astrological System

The S.P. Khullar Kalamsa and Cuspal Interlinks Theory (KCIL) is 21st century astrological nakshatra based system built upon K.S. Krishnamurti’s 20th century innovative work. The system is unique in Indian astrology, and if valid offers proof for a scientific basis of astrology, particularly the nakshatras.

“Kalamsa” refers to the sub-division of nakshatras or the 27 lunar mansions into nine parts. The Kalamsa divisions are further divided into nine which gives a total of 729 “nadi” type segments of varying lengths in the 300 degree zodiac. (For minute timing these 729 segments are again sub-divided twice, but that is for advanced work.)

In his Acknowledgment (Preface) to Your True Horoscope: Birth Time Rectification, Khullar writes: “[This book] has been written like my earlier books on astrology under the spell of inspiration and guidance of the Supreme Intelligence.” (Sagar Publications, 2011)

Ron Gaunt, an avid KCIL student and practitioner explains that in his 37 years of studying astrology, first the Tropical smorgasbord, the western Sidereal, then Hindu astrology, he did not find a system that really worked consistently for prediction.

Of Hindu astrology he states: “Hundreds of slokas and multiple ayanamsas, divisional charts etc. gave a plethora of combinations, in which it is possible to see anything you want–after the event–exactly the same as Tropical.” (Key to Learn Sub-Sub & Cuspal Interlinks Theory, Sagar Publications, 2008, p.xii) The KCIL system ended Gaunt’s search for a scientific astrological system that in his view truly works for prediction.

As it’s easier to understand a system with examples, I’d like to give a few examples using the charts of Megan, Harry, Duke of Sussex and their son, Archie of how the KCIL system is used for the rectification of recorded birth data, which illustrates the precision of the system. All three birth times have been slightly adjusted to bring all cusps into alignment between the charts as per KCIL rule. Calculations are by Mukesh Gupta’s True Astrology software, v5.7.1. Khullar followed Krishnamurti in using Placidus cusps, but I am testing equal cusps for two reasons:

(1) Many statements in Nadi texts state that when a planet comes to a specific degree or in a trine to that degree, a certain event occurs. Equal cusps place the same Kalamsa degrees on houses in trine to one another.

(2) Testing planets in houses, Placidus simply doesn’t work when analyzing a person’s life, but equal cusps as centers of houses are proving accurate in my on-going research.

All house cusps and planets have four lords:

SignL = sign lord
SrarL = nakshatra (star) lord
SL = sub (kalamsa) lord
SSL = sub-sub lord (micro “nadi” lord)

The Krishnamurti ayanamsa--Swiss Ephemeris is used for all calculations.
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Therese Hamilton



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Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rule #1 for Rectification:
The SSL lord of the ascendant of a chart must relate to the star lord (nakshatra or lunar mansion lord) of the Moon.

Megan’s Moon is in Moon ruled Hasta in Virgo. The time used is 4:45:10.175 (4:46 am recorded time) The TA computed ascendant is 0Cancer31. The smallest (SSL) division is used for rectification. The SSL planet is the Sun which is in the SL of the Moon, her Moon’s star lord. This qualifies her Hasta Moon. This SSL area is very small, running only from 30' 0" to 33' 20" of Cancer.

Harry’s computed birth time is 16:19:30 (16:20 recorded time) This gives an ascendant of 18Sag08 according to TA software.
Harry’s Moon star is Sun-ruled Krittika in Aries.
Harry’s SSL lord is Rahu. The Khullar system states that Rahu acts for its star and sign lords.
Rahu is located in Krittika in Taurus. So this SSL lord qualities Harry’s Sun star lord.

Archie’s birth time is very slightly adjusted from 4:26 am to 4:26:09.660 placing 18 Aries 28 on the ascendant.
Archie’s Moon star is Sun ruled Krittika in Taurus.

Archie’s SSL lord is Jupiter, which is not related to the Sun in any way.
However planets in a house act like virtual SSL lords, and Archie’s Sun is conjunct his ascendant in the first house within three degrees. This qualifies Archie’s star lord.

Thus with the times set by TA software, all three SSL lords reflect the star (nakshatra) lords of the Moons.

The next post will focus on family connections.
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Therese Hamilton



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Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An additional advanced and necessary Khullar Rectification Technique requires that there be “genetical” connections between parents and children and brothers and sisters. This is where Khullar rectification gets really interesting. The star (nakshatra) lord of the relevant family member must be linked to the SSL lord (micro “nadi” planet) of the relevant cusp.

Archie’s 4th cusp (mother) is in Cancer.
The SSL 4th lord is Saturn.
In Megan’s chart Saturn is in the Moon’s star, Hasta, with her Moon.

Archie’s four lords of the 4th house are Moon (Cancer), Me/Me/Sat
Meghan’s Saturn lords are Moon (Hasta), Me (Virgo), Rahu (SL)
Rahu acts for Moon (Cancer) and Sat (star lord)
So Megan’s Saturn lords match Archie’s 4th house lords.
Saturn as Archie’s micro lord of the 4th house refers back to Megan’s chart.

Always the reference micro SSL lord is taken as the primary key to a house and relationships.

Second family test:
Archie’s 9th cusp (father) is in Sagittarius.
The SSL lord is Jupiter (no reference to Sag on the 9th cusp). This does not reflect Harry’s Moon star lord, the Sun.
However, Ketu (virtual SSL lord) is in the 9th and is in the Sun’s star.

Furthermore (and this is fascinating!), Archie’s 9th SSL lord is Jupiter.
Saturn and Ketu are in Archie’s 9th house.
In Harry’s chart Archie’s SSL lord Jupiter is in Ketu’s star, Saturn’s sub, the SAME planets that are in Archie’s 9th house!

Third family test:
Archie is Megan’s son.
Her 5th house SSL is Sun, Archie’s Moon star.

Meghan’s 5th house lords are Ma (Sco); Ju (star lord)
Archie’s Asc lords are: Ma (Aries); Ju (SSL lord)

Fourth family test:
Archie is Harry’s son.
Harry’s 5th house SSL lord is Rahu
Rahu is in the Sun’s star; Archie’s star lord is the Sun.

Harry’s 5th house lords are Ma (Aries), Ve (star lord), Ra (SL), Ra (SSL)
Archie’s ascendant lords are Ma (Aries), Ve (star lord), Ra (SL)

With all these contacts, the family relationships between Harry, Megan and Archie are confirmed. According to the Khullar system, these are examples of parent-child connections that must exist if the birth times are valid. The Khullar system is obviously more left brain than right brain, even counter-intuitive as certain "scientific" principles have to be followed.

Thus it seems that such a structured system may be happier in academic research circles. If the system checks out, it certainly supports the validity of its foundation in Vimshottari Dasa measurements and equal 27-fold ecliptic measurements, today's lunar mansions. The system includes prediction in all areas of life covering the twelve astrological houses, so if research can validate the system, there would be concrete support for the astrological houses.
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james_m



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Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2019 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hi therese,

it is cool to see the use of nakshatras more prominent here.. i was wondering about how relevant the nakshatras actually are to indian astrology... they are given a lot of lip service, but i see very limited use of them in what i have read to date..

i wonder if the rules in place for this system are ever not proven... it seems like the theory is forced onto the data to make it work, and if the data doesn't work, they change the data... now, this is just my very limited impression and i haven't tried to do any of these exercises like yourself...

thanks for sharing as i find it thought provoking regardless of my questions..
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Therese Hamilton



Joined: 22 Feb 2011
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Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

James wrote:
Quote:
I wonder if the rules in place for this system are ever not proven... it seems like the theory is forced onto the data to make it work, and if the data doesn't work, they change the data... now, this is just my very limited impression and i haven't tried to do any of these exercises like yourself...

Yes, I see what you are saying, James. As far as adjusting time to make the theory work...let's say for family rectification...there are so many inter-connections that all have to work, plus known patterns and events of a life...that there is no leeway in precise positions. The planets and their rulers will be pretty much the same for a period of time. It's the cusps that change, reflecting tiny Nadi segments.

I think to understand this system, it's necessary to test it with our own lives and relationships. For example, I have three children, and my birth data and that of my husband are recorded. So all five charts have to fit together using the relevant cusps. Mother and father for children plus brothers and sisters, and children for the parents. It's kind of like a puzzle, each piece has to fit into place, and if one piece is off, the puzzle can't be completed. OR the system has to be questioned.

This process is actually difficult for me to check, because like most astrologers I'm more of an intuitive. A circular diagram of a chart will "talk" to most astrologers while tables of planets may draw a mental blank. I will probably try to check William and Kate's charts and those of their children because this would be more interesting to others than the personal charts of an astrologer.

I think the Khullar system is worth investigating, but I'm not sure how far I would personally get with studying it. It takes mental discipline which I don't seem to have much of lately! But I am very curious to see if such a precise system actually checks out in similar ways among a number of charts. So family data is a good place to start. Remember that for relationships, the key has to be that tiny Nadi segment of cusps. That is the theory anyway.
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Therese Hamilton



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Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

James wrote:
Quote:
It is cool to see the use of nakshatras more prominent here.. i was wondering about how relevant the nakshatras actually are to indian astrology... they are given a lot of lip service, but i see very limited use of them in what i have read to date..

Up until the 1990s when so many new books on the nakshatras appeared, India's astrology was mostly zodiac based. Then in the 1990s astrologers began to think more about the 27 lunar mansions. But the so-called characteristics of the mansions may not work so well. In the mid 20th century Krishnamurti discovered that transits and dasas and sub-periods of dasas actually referred to Vimshottari lords of the mansions. His work has brought the mansions back to center stage for astrologers who investigate the KP and Khullar systems. A recent research paper by John Ryder actually supposrts this view. Ryder concludes:

Quote:

The timing of elevation of major political leaders of the 20
th century has been found to have a strong non-random
correlation with a predictive rule based on the techniques of Vedic
astrology. This has relied on a key group of kendra and
trikona lord yogas, including the Raja Yogas and Maha Purusha Yogas studied by Hubball.
These yoga planets exerted influence as dispositors of the dasha planets
acting at the time of elevation, working within the Vimshottari dasha system of Jyotish, in numbers that are highly statistically significant...

Gochara.com Preprint
The Timing of Rise to Eminence for Leading Politicians and other
Celebrities – Statistical Analysis of Predictive Patterns in Vedic Astrology
John Ryder

http://gochara.com/uploads/pdf/Ryder_Stats_Paper_Jul_2013a.pdf

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AJ



Joined: 01 Nov 2018
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Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Therese Hamilton wrote:
Rule #1 for Rectification:
The SSL lord of the ascendant of a chart must relate to the star lord (nakshatra or lunar mansion lord) of the Moon.

Harry’s computed birth time is 16:19:30 (16:20 recorded time) This gives an ascendant of 18Sag08 according to TA software.
Harry’s Moon star is Sun-ruled Krittika in Aries.
Harry’s SSL lord is Rahu. The Khullar system states that Rahu acts for its star and sign lords.
Rahu is located in Krittika in Taurus. So this SSL lord qualities Harry’s Sun star lord.

Thus with the times set by TA software, all three SSL lords reflect the star (nakshatra) lords of the Moons.

Help me out here Therese. I am using a KP program called KP Star One so the times are a bit different from yours but close enough I think for the discussion. Anyway Harrys natal Moon is in Aries in Moon Star the Sun (Krittika Nakshatra). I’m fine this far with Harry’s rectification then I am totally lost from here.
Why does Rahu even play at all, just because it happens to fall in the same Star as the Moon? Wouldn’t this place more emphasis on the Sun? Why choose Rahu over the Sun? Even if Rahu takes on the qualities of the Star it inhabits why does this trump the Sun? Is this part of the Khuller rule book for rectification?
The Rahu rising in Meghans chart was also invoked into the rectification as well.
In my table of subs, the 16:20:46 with the Sun would seem to be the better fit.

The sub sub lord cycle from Rahu to Rahu is 2m43s just to put the levels in perspective.
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Therese Hamilton



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Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AJ wrote:
Quote:
Why does Rahu [in Harry’s birth chart] even play at all, just because it happens to fall in the same Star as the Moon? Wouldn’t this place more emphasis on the Sun? Why choose Rahu over the Sun? Even if Rahu takes on the qualities of the Star it inhabits why does this trump the Sun? Is this part of the Khuller rule book for rectification?

Hi AJ,
Yes, you are right. For initial rectification checking for Harry's Moon star the Sun would be a more obvious fit. My software doesn’t give a list as KP Star One does. It simply adjusts in increments from the given birth time. So Rahu came up before the Sun as SSL lord.

A Khullar principle states that Rahu and Ketu act as their house (cusp) lords and star lords. So in Harry's chart Rahu acts as the Sun, its star lord, but not because it happens to be in the same star as the Moon.

Software accuracy is critical in setting time for SSL lords, and the times/subs are different between KP Star and True Astrology. So for Rahu/Rahu TA gives a time of 16:19:30, 30 seconds from the recorded time. KP Star gives a time of 16:21:09 for Rahu/Rahu.

KP Star gives 16:20:46 for the Sun’s SSL lord as Mars/Sun which is 46 seconds later than the recorded time. TA gives a time of 16:19.7.490 for Mars sub/Sun SSL.

Just now I'm checking my hard copy papers when I had been using printed KP tables, and I see that I had chosen Ju/Ve/Ma/Sun for Harry's ascendant. With the confusion of problems with TA I was having, I see that I didn't go back far enough in increments to reach Ma/Sun. (I had also been checking other families...maybe too much detail for my "intuitive" brain!)

If you have found KP Star One very accurate in relation to other programs, I would have to look into that program if I want to do further research with the Khullar system. The table in your post is more useful than the single increments TA uses. Just checking now: I see that some KP software from India sells for more than USD $400!!

I have edited this post several times, so AJ, if you reply, be sure you are reading the latest version. (Time: 3 June 8:16 PM U.K.)
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AJ



Joined: 01 Nov 2018
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Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Therese Hamilton wrote:
If you have found KP Star One very accurate in relation to other programs, I would have to look into that program if I want to do further research with the Khullar system. The table in your post is more useful than the single increments TA uses. Just checking now: I see that some KP software from India sells for more than USD $400!!

KP Star One is free though it does require online registration. The values do vary a tick from my goto program Sri Jyoti Star, but SJS has always been highly accurate and does use Swiss ephemeris. See the screen shots below and for comparison. Used the KP original ayanamsa. Equal house cusps.

On the KP Star One website, it does say it uses Swiss ephemeris, so I can't account for the difference other than how they calculate the ayanamsa. There is a 49" difference in the ayanamsa calc. between the 2 programs but still this doesn't account for all of the differences in the values. The developer of SJS has this note on his application of the KP ayanamsa, "The values for the Krishnamurti Ayanamsha are based on his books and discussions with several leading KP practitioners. This led to the very small adjustment to the 50 second procession of Varahamihira due to 1'/year of proper motion of Spica."
Perhaps this is the difference. Most ayanamsa calcs in software are usually defined by an epoch and an initial ayanamsha offset. On other words no proper motion is accounted for. I know in SJS nutation is also taken into account.

With this in mind I ran the two charts without ayanamsa...
Now with no ayanamsa or tropical values they are very close especially on the planetary values. See the additional screenshots below too. KP Star One based on this is accurate.

I would be interested how it compared with the True Astrology program you use.

Oh yeah... One big drawback for most western users is the lack of chart wheels. Even the North India charts are bad (read "really sucks" here), if you can live with that and the house values being within a quarter of a degree it seems pretty sound otherwise, but I have not worked with it much at all.

The table of ascendants with the subs is very nice compared to doing them manually, and if you are working to the 3rd level of rulers or greater, accuracy is paramount.

http://newsite.kpstarone.com/index.php?vaction=home

Here is what SJS has for Harry's natal planets BT 04:20:00

Here is a screenshot from KP Star One.
Image removed...

No ayanamsa or Tropical values


Image removed...


Last edited by AJ on Mon Jun 03, 2019 9:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Therese Hamilton



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Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 7:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AJ, I have printed the first section of the longitude tables (except the Tropical) for reference. Could you please delete the wide column tables? My screen is the older 4:3 ratio, and the wide tables run off the screen and can't be printed anyway. Thanks!
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james_m



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Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hi therese,

thanks for your additional comments and the link to the pdf on this topic of the value of research in regards to yogas, and the lords of the kendras and trikonas..

from page 10 of the pdf you link to
" Out of 89 planets in 67 yogas in these charts, only 12 exerted a direct influence as the dasha lord at time of elevation; it seems apparent from these results that the yoga planets do not play a significant direct role in the timing of events. The yoga planets appear to contribute their energy strongly as depositors however, in numbers that are unlikely to have arisen through random chance. There is also a high success rate of 75% of the charts for this case, which is supported by the ability of depositor planets to influence wider areas of the chart. This supports the study of strong planets exerting influence as both sign and nakshatra depositors as a valuable Jyotish technique. "

and page 16 "Conclusion - The timing of elevation of major political leaders of the 20th century has been found to have a strong non-random correlation with a predictive rule based on the techniques of Vedic astrology. This has relied on a key group of kendra and trikona lord yogas, including the Raja Yogas and Maha Purusha Yogas studied by Hubball. These yoga planets exerted influence as depositors of the dasha planets acting at the time of elevation, working within the Vimshottari dasha system of Jyotish, in numbers that are highly statistically significant (P § 0.002). The self-contained nature of the data sample of leaders’ charts adds interest and meaning to this result."
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AJ



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Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 11:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Therese Hamilton wrote:
AJ, I have printed the first section of the longitude tables (except the Tropical) for reference. Could you please delete the wide column tables? My screen is the older 4:3 ratio, and the wide tables run off the screen and can't be printed anyway. Thanks!

FYI Therese: I went ahead and did the manual calculation for the tropical ascendant of a verified test chart against SJS just make sure. It was spot on to the second. I am quite satisfied that SJS data is just about as good as it gets.
Cheers.
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Therese Hamilton



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Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

True Astrology has very nice Western wheels. Bi and tri-wheels also. And the planets all go into the right houses depending on whether you use the cusp as the start or center of a house. I don't have any other program that does this. I can't figure out the colors though. There's no option to set colors.


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Last edited by Therese Hamilton on Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:47 am; edited 3 times in total
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Therese Hamilton



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Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 12:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AJ wrote:
Quote:
FYI Therese: I went ahead and did the manual calculation for the tropical ascendant of a verified test chart against SJS just make sure. It was spot on to the second. I am quite satisfied that SJS data is just about as good as it gets.

I'm sure you are right, AJ. Recent western programs are tops for calculation. I've done some comparisons, but can't post until later tonight. I had asked you before, but I think my question got lost. You posted a circular chart on another topic. Was that from SJS?
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AJ



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Posted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 12:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Therese Hamilton wrote:
True Astrology has very nice Western wheels. Double and triple wheels also. And the planets all go into the right houses depending on whether you use the cusp as the start or center of a house. I don't have any other program that does this.

The wheels are clean looking.

That's one downside with SJS, it will only do single and a bi-wheel and not a particularly elegant one at that. They're very serviceable but not a gold star on the graphics scale. I've asked the developer many times to do a tri-wheel feature but he round-a-bout'ly told he wasn't going to add one. All things being equal, still the best Indian astro software in my experience.

Are True Astrology pages customizable?
Do you know if it is Windows 10 compatible?
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