Bridge collapse

2
The New York Times has a video of the collapse. See it at:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/02/us/02 ... ge.html?hp

This seems to have been taken by a motion-activated surveillance camera. The date & exact time are stamped on it:

August 1, 2007
18.01.40 CDT
Minneapolis, MN, USA: 44N58, 93W15

The chart has 26 58 of Sag rising, with Pluto retrograde at 26 Sag 38. The MC is 24 07 Libra. With Placidus houses you get Neptune, north node, moon (at 17 11 Pisces) and Uranus in the second, and Sun, Saturn, Venus & the south node in the 8th, with Fortuna & Mercury late in the 7th, Jupiter retrograde in Sag in 12.

The old hands I knew in New York long ago would always run the TransNeps for charts like this. I didn't as I can't read them, but I would expect them to turn up tight to various planets & angles.

ON TO THE CAMERA!

It shows the bridge dropping level into the water, as if all support on both ends of the span failed simultaneously. Frankly, that smells.

The structure of the bridge is identical to the structure of a table: a leg, or pier, on each of the four corners. All four have to fail at the same time for the bridge to drop level into the water, which is what the video shows.

I'm not a civil engineer, I don't play one on TV & I didn't sleep in that fancy motel last night, but this looks, to me, like sabotage.

If so, my question is why? We've all been expecting another "terrorist event", but if this is it, then why has no one come rushing forth to exploit it for propaganda purposes?

You will note Jupiter at 9 Sag is conjunct the Declaration of Independence ascendant, if you use a 4:50-ish pm birth time. Would retrograde mean some official acting as a renegade?

Dave
www.AstroAmerica.com
Better books make better astrologers. Treat yourself!

3
One small technical matter: The AP and BBC reports I had seen gave the time as 6:05 pm, but Ill go ahead and use 6:01:40.

The Cancer Ingress Chart for Minneapolis:
?The ingress chart places Pluto conjunct the IC (30' orb) trine Mars, which is in the 8th near the cusp [Placidus] and ruling the 8th and 3rd. That partile Mars-Pluto trine figured prominently in the London Cancer ingress chart [http://skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2534].

?The ingressed Sun?s last 2 aspects were a sextile to Mars preceded by an opposition to Pluto. This solar connection makes the partile Mars-Pluto trine key for Cancer ingress charts worldwide. The Pluto-IC (angular) conjunction makes Minneapolis one of the hot spots for the Mars-Pluto trine.

?The Sun is conjunct the MC (orb 1 * 55', applying) and square the ASC (orb 1*36',applying).

In the Collapse Chart:
?Pluto is conjunct the ASC (20', separating). Here?s a direct connection with the Pluto-IC conjunction and Mars-Pluto partile trine of the Cancer ingress chart.

?Mars in detriment is square Saturn in detriment (31', separating), potentially ugly and destructive. Mars is ruler of the 4th and ties with the Sun as almuten. Using the Ptolemy terms Saturn is the 10th house almuten; using Egyptian terms Venus and Saturn are equally scored for almuten. Venus is the domicile ruler of the 10th.

?With Venus and Saturn descending in the 8th, and Mars also descending and nearing the lowest point; and with these planets linked as rulers and almutens to the highest and lowest chart points (MC & IC), is it outlandish to see this as a depiction of something elevated coming down, especially with that destructive Mars-Saturn square? Libra on the MC is an air sign and air signs signify high places: ?As an air sign, Libra governs places that are exposed to light and air or those that are high off the ground.? [http://www.skyscript.co.uk/libra.html] As I said, Mars rules the 4th. The 4th house has connections with drowning. Can we say that 'under water' is the same as the traditional 'underground' signification for the 4th? The Sun is tied with Mars as 4th house almuten. Sun is in Cancer. Could this be enough to indicate that we are dealing with ? falling into ? a river in the 4th?

?The Sun rules the 8th and is placed therein. It is trine the 12th house retrograde Jupiter ? ruler of the 3rd. Trines cause flow of movement and easy release.

?The Moon is closely applying conjunct Uranus, and they are both conjunct the 3rd house cusp. The Moon's last aspect was square Jupiter (ruler of 3rd) and its next aspect is the conjunction with Uranus.

Fingerprints

4
Oh what the heck. Let's get nasty.

The 8th house of the collapse chart is conjunct GW Bush's ascendant.

The sun in the collapse chart is conjunct GW Bush's Mercury

GW Bush's Mars is not quite one full degree from the collapse south node.

The two Saturns are exactly semi-sextile.

The MC on the collapse chart exactly opposes GW's own MC.

The ruler of the collapse MC, Venus, is in the 8th of the collapse chart, retrograde. Retrograde Venus is rare.

The ruler of the collapse MC in GW's chart, Venus, is at 21 Leo. Saturn went over this in late June, which I think accounts for his current poor standing in the polls. It is exactly opposed by the collapse chart Neptune.

On the other end of that axis, the ruler of the collapse IC is Mars. GW's Mars is exactly square the collapse Jupiter, which is the ascendant ruler for the collapse chart. As I mentioned, that same Mars is one degree from conjuncting the collapse south node. And it's exactly semi-sextile the collapse sun.

GW Bush, if you don't have it: 6 July 1946, 7:26 am EDT, New Haven, CT.

I am of the opinion that close aspects, such as these, can be used to determine the guilty party when no other clues are present.

I first tried this technique with the sudden collapse of the first of the two World Trade Towers, which was positively the most horrifying thing I have ever seen. I chose that moment as I am convinced the towers were brought down by pre-planted explosives. If true, this meant someone had to detonate the charges, and if so, then there could only have been a small number of hands that would have been trusted to do so.

I compared the demolition of the first tower to the charts of GW Bush, Dick Cheney & Donald Rumsfeld, and while I could see that each of them profited from that moment in time (and each in a different way), I could not see any direct link. There was one other person, who, to date, has escaped notice. He is the actual owner of the Towers themselves, a certain Mr. Larry Silverstein. He is openly credited with deliberately demolishing WTC7, which was, in fact, done with pre-planted charges. (Forty story buildings do not blow down in the wind.) To date, I have not found birth data for him.

It will be most interesting to see what comes of the Minneapolis bridge collapse in the coming weeks.

Dave
www.AstroAmerica.com
Better books make better astrologers. Treat yourself!

5
Between solar ingresses and events come lunations.

The July 14th New Moon for Minneapolis has the lunation in the 12th at 21 Cancer 41 in a partile square with the MC-IC axis with an orb of 25', applying. The MC-IC axis consists of the same signs as in the event chart ? Libra and Aries ? but reversed. Otherwise, I?m not finding much in this chart.

BUT:
The July 29th Full Moon chart puts Mars in the 4th. Mars rules the 3rd and 10th. Mars as ruler of the 10th all the way at the bottom of the chart, in detriment and applying square (1* 04') Saturn in detriment looks ominous ? especially as ruler of the 3rd, from what we now know. Saturn is the ASC ruler; Mars rules the MC. They are both angularly placed. So the 2 ol? malefics in detriment and closely applying square have the potential and strength to cause a lot of trouble.

The Full Moon itself is located in the 1st house with the Sun in the 7th, so there?s a shot of energy for the next 2 weeks.




But screw all this waste of time. George W. Bush did it with a remote control. Somebody taught him how to use one.

6
It dawned on me that the traditional practice is to look at the Aries ingress chart for a location. If the ASC is in a fixed sign the chart is valid all year; in a mutable sign it?s valid 6 months until the Libra ingress; if the ASC is in a cardinal sign it?s only valid 3 months until the Cancer ingress. That always seemed contrived and arbitrary to me, but the proof is in experience. So I drew up the Aries ingress chart for Minneapolis.


2007 Aries Ingress Chart for Minneapolis
?The angles are in the same signs as the Cancer ingress chart and only 1 degree off. (It?s the same for my location ? does that happen often?)

?The Sun is 2 and a half degrees from the Descendant and square Pluto, which is a bit less than 2 degrees from the IC.

?I?m always trying to use the Part of Fortune. It seems that a point calculated from the Sun, Moon and ASC should be meaningful and important. The POF in the Aries ingress chart is 24 Libra 18. The MC of the collapse chart is 24 Libra 07. [I?m still using the 6:01:40 video time].

?In the collapse event chart Mars and Saturn are half a degree from having perfected a square. In the Aries ingress chart Mars and Saturn are applying to opposition with an orb of 1 and a half degrees. They are joined in configuration by Neptune conjunct Mars and Jupiter in the 3rd sextile Mars-Neptune and trine Saturn. Jupiter is the dispositor of the IC-Pluto conjunction, as well as ruler of the angular 7th. Jupiter here is in the 3rd. In the collapse event chart Jupiter rules the 3rd and is the dispositor of the Moon-Uranus conjunction near the 3rd house cusp.

Mars and Saturn are closely approaching opposition in the Aries ingress chart and have just completed their square in the collapse event chart. We should look at another chart. What was going on in the last Mars-Saturn conjunction chart, the beginning of the current cycle, calculated for Minneapolis?


2006 Mars-Saturn Conjunction for Minneapolis
June 18, 2006, 1:09 am CDT. +5:00
ASC: 21 Pisces 03 (The 3rd house cusp for the collapse using 6:01:40 pm was 20 Pisces 15)
MC: 25 Sag 43. And there?s Pluto again conjunct the MC at 25 Sag 23.
The ASC for the collapse chart was 26 Sag 58.
The IC for the Aries ingress chart was 27 Sag 00.

?The Mars-Saturn conjunction was at 8 Leo 46, about 2 degrees from the Placidus 6th house, and tightly square Jupiter (42', app.) in Scorpio conjunct the 8th house cusp. Remember that Jupiter was in the 3rd house in the 9-month-later Aries ingress chart, and it ruled the 3rd ? and the Moon-Uranus conjunction ? in the collapse chart.

?The dispositor of the Mars-Saturn conjunction is the Sun, which is tightly conjunct the IC here and opposed Pluto hovering near the MC. As in the Aries ingress chart above both the Sun and Pluto are tightly conjunct angles. The POF is with the Sun at the IC. There is an applying Sun-Moon square near the angles.

?The Sun (dispositor of the Mars-Saturn conjunction) is powerful with its placement on an angle. It is applying square to the Moon's Nodes, which are powerfully placed in the 1st and 7th. I use mean nodes, so there?s an orb of 3* 12'. That would indicate some sort of upcoming crisis.

?Mercury looks harmless enough, so tightly trine the Moon and ASC. Mercury here in the conjunction chart does happen to rule both the 3rd and 4th houses. Most interestingly, Mercury here at 21 Cancer 37 is nearly exactly the same position as the July 14, 2007 New Moon at 21 Cancer (which squared the MC-IC axis of that chart with 25' orb).

?The July 29, 2007 Full Moon before the collapse was at 6 AQ 31. The 2006 Mars-Saturn conjunction was at 8 Leo 46. That looks like it may be close enough for activation.


I sure hope I haven?t switched things around after looking at so many charts.

7
So here I go again.

The ancients looked to the conjunctions of the 3 superior planets in their mundane work. I?ve often thought that following the relationships of Mars, Jupiter and Saturn to each other would be worthwhile. This recent bridge collapse has led me to look at one of the superior conjunctions.

The Mars-Saturn conjunction would seem to start a cycle of destructive influences. The 2006 conjunction chart with Minneapolis as the location is fascinating. Using only the 7 traditional planets makes it especially clear. If you draw up the chart try looking at it with only those bodies on screen. I will be repeating myself somewhat in the following.

Mars, Saturn and Jupiter are all closely tied together. None of them aspects any other planet; they are their own group. That is the case worldwide. In the Minneapolis chart for the Mars-Saturn event Jupiter rules the ASC and MC ? so this location is linked to the malefics through their square to Jupiter. Jupiter is retrograde so the square is mutually applying. There is mutual reception between Mars and Jupiter in combinations of rulership, triplicity and fate [I didn?t know how to word this clearly]. Once again, the influence would be worldwide, but is brought specifically to Minneapolis through Jupiter?s rulership of the ASC and MC. Mars, Saturn and Jupiter being conjunct house cusps (Placidus) also links the conjunction event to this location.

Also bringing the Mars-Saturn cycle to this location would be the conjunction?s dispositor, the Sun ? placed only slightly more than one degree from the IC. The Sun is also currently involved in its weekly lunar connection through an applying waning Moon-Sun square. That square?s energy is also brought to power in this location by the Moon?s one and a half degree distance from the Ascendant. And to maybe give the Sun a bit more importance, the conjunction happened during the Sun hour at this location.

I?m done for now. [applause]

8
Well you have worked hard. BIG applause!
I think that is an interesting technique that you mentioned in your second post ? looking for connections to natal charts to find culpability. Your views are obviously quite controversial, so it is probably worth reminding other members that the theory was put forward on an astrological basis, so any disagreements should be made on an astrological basis too.

Thanks for the in-depth analysis Kirk.

9
Hello Deb & Kirk,

Kirk has some really good stuff, will have a look at it later.

If GWB was behind this in one fashion or another, then I'm still puzzling why. Terror events go stale fast. A bridge that drops horizontally into the water? In the past that's only happened when they have been deliberately demolished (which happens occasionally) & there should be video of such.

Maybe it was a dry run for some more spectacular event? If so, this technique won't work on the four bridges commonly thought to be at risk (two in New York, two in San Francisco), as they are all suspension.

Could it be the President of the United States, having become bored or frustrated with his office, and with a long history of acting out, has now embarked on a new career, going around the country secretly blowing things up? It is true that I have never seen him smirk so vainly as in the immediate aftermath of some great loss of life. Partying while Katrina was still in full force (will he be compared to Nero with his fiddle?). I am reminded of Hitler, dancing his jig upon hearing news of the fall of France.

The most immediate prior disaster was the tornado that wiped out Greensburg, Kansas. When I was very small I lived there briefly, and much of my family still lives in that state. There is a time for that event. Of course, tornadoes cannot be made to order & then set upon some luckless town. Or can they?

Back when I have an answer.

Dave
www.AstroAmerica.com
Better books make better astrologers. Treat yourself!

10
The structure of the bridge is identical to the structure of a table:


Hate to burst this bubble but a truss support has nothing in common with the four legs that support a table.
A truss bridge is a bridge composed of connected elements (typically straight) which may be stressed from tension, compression, or sometimes both in response to dynamic loads. Truss bridges are one of the oldest types of modern bridges. This type of bridge structure has a fairly simple design and is particularly cheap to construct owing to its efficient use of materials. For purposes of analysis most truss bridges may be considered to be pin jointed where the straight components meet. A more complex analysis may be required where rigid joints impose significant bending loads upon the elements. From Wikipedia the fastest source I could find.
It is impossible for a bridge of this size or even a lot smaller to hold any kind of load, not even its own weight, if it were held up like a table. As the above quote states the truss joints are "pinned" more or less. If these "pinned" connections corrode, whatever they are holding together collapses. Does anyone recall working with an Erector Set as a child? Now there is more to it than a simple pin holding the bridge up. In some types of construction, the steel is joined with several bolts at areas called "faying surfaces." The number of bolts depends on the size of the steel. The connections are placed at strategic places designed by engineers, based on the precise design and expected load. If the two pieces of steel at the joined area just move greatly, it could cause a collapse. Obviously I have no idea what happened here.

Truss construction is commonly used throughout the US and probably elsewhere. If legitimate experts have not yet had the time to determine a cause, I doubt second guessers and conspiracy theorists have been able to do more and do it faster with less.

Also unlike what the finger pointers and tongue waggers on the air would have us believe, this is not the first major bridge collapse in US history. In fact there was a worse one in 1983 on Interstate 95 in Connecticut that was due to design flaws. Other bridges have twisted and crumbled during a good storm. There is the famous film of the bridge dubbed "Galloping Gurdy,"

http://www.promotega.org/asu30023/disasterswind.html

taken at its collapse in 1940. The bridge was hit by cross winds and was tossed around like a hammock in a hurricane until it crumbled. It's a tragedy, they happen, and blaming one's favorite enemies adds nothing worthwhile to any subject. My favorite folks to point fingers at are the one that confiscate monies set aside for infrastructure maintenance and use it to buy votes with social programs. Whoops, those are local politicians. They'll never get blamed. The responsibility for maintaining this particular bridge was that of the Minnesota Department of Transportation. Steel and concrete corrode if not properly maintained regardless of the current political climate.

As for all four corners of the Minneapolis bridge hitting the water simultaneously, the film I saw shows what I believe to be the south end collapsing first and puling the north end with it.

Tom

11
Hello Moderator,

Apologies, but you've got the wrong bubble. Whatever the trusses are made of, however they're designed, they have to sit on something. Call them legs, call them feet, call them piers, or what you will. Remove them, and the trusses above will fall.

I've seen the film of Galloping Gertie. It's a good example why suspension bridges cannot be brought down by a simple attack. It's also a perfect example of what happens when you stress the trusses, not the supporting piers or moorings. The trusses bend, they flex, and, ultimately, the various joints fail, one by one. The process is never instantaneous.

And it's exactly that sort of bending & flexing & individual failure that was so clearly not in evidence on 9-11.

It will rapidly become clear if the piers under the Minneapolis bridge were dynamited, YES or NO. Or there will be some diversion or cover up. I was encouraged the (historically Democratic) city had declared the bridge a crime scene. It was a pro-forma declaration, but still.

It was an eight lane bridge. There were a minimum of four piers, and a maximum of perhaps 16. For the bridge to come down as evenly as it did, they all had to fail within one second of each other. (I'm an old photo hand. Within one-tenth of a second, if you really want to know.) If 15 fail, but one does not, then the bridge hangs at that precise point until the force generated by the 15 other failures overwhelms the one that did not. How long would that take, what would it look like? Look again at the Gertie film, a record of genuine engineering failure, not deliberate destruction.

Previous bridge collapses, in Los Angeles & San Francisco, were the result of Richter 6.5-7.0 earthquakes. I was in the '93 LA quake.

In this case, and with any luck, the paranoid conspiracy nuts - like me - will compress the three years it took to figure out 9-11 into three or four days.

Dave

PS: Failure of all the piers on one end (2 - 8 individual points of support) will not pull the other end loose. Bridges are not so flimsy as that.
www.AstroAmerica.com
Better books make better astrologers. Treat yourself!

12
I've added the graphic into the top post, because I think we need to see that aspectual connection between Pluto on the ascendant, Saturn in the 8th, and Mars (which rules the 4th: foundation beneath), conjunct Algol.

In the Granville train disaster chart, I thought that the elevated position of Uranus near the midheaven was significant for a disaster that involved the collapse of a bridge from above (there it was only the victims in the train below that suffered). It does seem interesting that here the Moon is so close to Uranus on the 3rd house cusp, as it translates from the 3rd-ruler to Uranus.
Last edited by Deb on Sat Aug 04, 2007 11:10 am, edited 1 time in total.