I find this law 7 quiet frightening

"And thus the sign of the 1st house of the radix in the 12th house and or the 8th house of the revolution treaten illnesses, imprisonment, ennemies and death or dangers to life"

while in my RS 2009, i will have RS ascendant scorpio in 8 th house natal, lord 1 Mars (pluton) in 2nd house Revolution. but also i read that any planet combust to the sun presage misfortune, loss of honour

Well i will have mars combust sun in second house and maybe pluto (orb too large i think). Should i be worry?

if i look the dignity mars is in exaltion in capricorn hence is this combustion diminish the positive influence. Additionally the second malefic saturn Solar retrograde trine sun solar

If i look at the natal aspects i have only saturn square sun (grrr)

aspects to RS mars trine RS MC and conjonct MC natal, Sun RS sextile RS Ascendant and pluton conjonct MC natal but i am ensure as to whether it trines MC Revolution (various softwares give me different information

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Hi, there, zohra

I remember the first thing that scared the hell out of me when I looked at my chatrt for the first was the position of the 1st house ruler in the 12th. The other way around explanations (L12 in 1st) can be scary as well. But do be careful with this! The best "cure" is to find as many charts of people with such position in their Natal charts (just Google a bit, Astrotheme is a great source) especially famous people or people you know and try focusing on how such position affects or has affected their lives. You'll find very few of them being imprisoned actually . On the other hand, you'll find many famous people with strong emphasis on the 12th house where their Ascendant ruler went who have managed to pull out the best from such position (or should I say- that's how their story has unfolded with or without their will, depending of the chart in general) with no prisons, criminal or secret enemies for- there are other meanings of this house too, aren't there. I've often seen a strong emphasis on the 12th house and L1 being placed there in charts of great writers but that is no rule, of course - everything needs to be taken into account to see how that house and L1 inside of it will act in reality (in other and better words- what they promise to bring rather than what they'll inevitably bring). Have you ever seen the charts of G.W. Bush or even tony Blair (the Masters of the 12th house, that's how I call them ). Needles to say, people who are professionally involved in 12th and 8th house matters, working in such surroundings or professionally involved with people traditionally represented by 8th and 12th (prosecutors, public defenders, nuns, investigators, secret service,forensics etc.- just some of the examples I've seen,but also smugglers and people working in institutions providing help for the poor, of course ) will have strong 8th or 12th in their charts as well. Solitude can also bee observed through that house but it won't neccessarilly denote someone spending a life in a dark cell, the rest of the chart will tell us whether the Native chooses that solitude willingly or not. Philosophers usually have a strong 12th- it is their house, after all, and philosophy requires periods of solitude, it actually brings creativity to life.
What I want to say is that one needs to be very precise and objective when observing this house and any planets found there. Just like with any other house, it can present itself in numerous ways. There's an interesting topic about mental illness here in this part of the forum, it might be helpful to read it (unless you already have) to see how some general "rules" depend of the rest of the chart and how sometimes strong signs (or at least the aspects and positions that are usually followed by "negative" explanations) always work in a team with other planets and, sometimes, the rest of the team is stronger. It's not all black and white. Not in life, not in astrology.
If you think you can't look at this house in your chart clearly and from a certain distance that would allow you to see thing in the real light, perhaps you should consult someone else, someone who could approach your chart more objectively. (even the Therapists sometimes seek for a pro help, why shouldn't Astrologers as weel!? )

what a wonderful and reassuring comments you made
the position of the malefic i was talking are related for the revolution 09.
I guess i read too much in few days anthony louis and majority of the charts mentioned in the book seem doom to death, hell misery. Not a joyful outcome for learning. is when i read a section of Astrologica gallatica as regards to solar return that i came across this section of ascendant of the revolution (house of malefic) and 12th and or 8 th house)
a book for your halloween night. Than i tried to reassure by reading other authors and guess what the same whether in english/french/spanish astrologues

Do they come from the same school of tought


Than i decided to ignore their comments and try to review past revolution where the ascendant was in scorpio and malefic combust sun but can't find any in my nearly 40 years

Than when this step did not bring any conclusion, i decided to lighten up and take only aspects that also agree with my natal (i.e like saturn square sun NT) is trine my SR MC so this will produce an effect

i also decided that scorpio is a powerful sign on its own right and with the use of its whip, i get a free therapy

So now thinking about the rulers well there are not bad aspected in my natal (pluto is between 2 world) and mars is exalted in scorpio and they do not have any aspects to the sun and or saturn, So i guess i can i can sleep easily tonight. As regard to my 12th house (pisces) i have the lesser benefit venus in exaltation but i have neptune in 8th house and pluton sextile neptune/moon

the dark world i deal with are my 6 sense (psychic ability)

And as you stated maybe getting some help, well i need to wait december to ask my french astrologue to do my new birthday 40 ( ) and compare my amateurish works and his exceptional talent

but until than i will celebrate hallowen

Zohra,

You really need to be more careful with your quotes if you want others to help out. First the book on revolutions is not book 13 but rather book 23. Secondly the aphorism you site is not No. 7 but rather number 8 (page 131), and finally you left off the most important part of the quote:

And thus the sign of the 1st house of the radix in the 12th house and or the 8th house of the revolution threaten illnesses, imprisonment, enemies and death or dangers to life if the radix and its directions agree: ...

Morin's work on solar returns (SR not RS) is profound. He teaches a thorough and logically consistent approach to this topic in a depth we unlikely to find anywhere else. Those words you left off put his thoughts into the proper context. He is manifestly not saying that any time Lord 1 of the natal chart ends up in the 8th or 12th of the solar return, the native is in danger of imprisonment, death, illness, or worse. That must be seen in the natal chart first and then it must be triggered by primary directions and THEN if those positions occur in the return look for trouble particularly in the month that the lunar return angles duplicate the solar return angles. The whole point of Book 23 is that revolutions foretell the promise of the natal chart when they duplicate the promise of the nativity in that particular return.

So having Lord 1 in 8 or 12 with no other testimonies to support the bad stuff means little or nothing and that isn't me making the claim; it's Morin.

Tom

Tom wrote:Zohra,
Morin's work on solar returns (SR not RS) is profound.
Tom

LOL.. I'm glad you clarified that. I was trying to remember or think what the heck "RS" stood for!

RC

Hi, Zohra,

I always say that the SR and LR are the two most deadly astrological tools.


Everybody who draw their lunar return for the first time says "oh, my god, I am going to die ! And in the first LR that I cast!"

But with time we learn that principle... nothing really important happens in most of days and years.

Look for your revolutions throught your life, then to the SR of your friends, and try to get a grisp.

My advice: never use the SR as stand alone technique... the SR should be ALWAYS be looked compared to the nativity, and with other techniques as well, as Firdaria, profections and primary or secondary directions.

Best regards

Hi tom

Thank you to pinpoint my mistakes, i appreciate, my comments were not made to go against Morin and or anyone but mainly try to understand his knoweldge as regards to SR.

And thus the sign of the 1st house of the radix in the 12th house and or the 8th house of the revolution threaten illnesses, imprisonment, enemies and death or dangers to life if the radix and its directions agree

I did not have the last bit "if the radix and its directions agree", a friend has forgotten to copy those last sentence so i do apologise to have type book 13 instead of 23. fingers errors

I am just experimenting and testing as there are so many science around us. My search started with many authors such as Teal, Volguine, shea etc but i was fascinated with Anthony louis book as stated in my previous e-mail and by reading its contents i came across some of his case studies and Morin and Volguine. At the present time I do not have any preference that i can relate to. So i am still in a learning stage.
You are right i should be careful but it was innocent, lots of us are so amateur that we do not realise that sometimes, our comments can be seen as a confrontation to others beliefs and expertise (the advanced student) and or damaging to the author's works.

He is manifestly not saying that any time Lord 1 of the natal chart ends up in the 8th or 12th of the solar return, the native is in danger of imprisonment, death, illness, or worse. That must be seen in the natal chart first and then it must be triggered by primary directions and THEN if those positions occur in the return look for trouble particularly in the month that the lunar return angles duplicate the solar return angles

I think i should take it slowly this learning, i do not practice Lunar return Yet already SR can be a dangerous tool

Yuzuru

I always say that the SR and LR are the two most deadly astrological tools.

Gosh you are spot on, your heart bit faster when you misjudged the tools

But with time we learn that principle... nothing really important happens in most of days and years.

Well i bought myself a diary yesterday to record my next year HALF 80 YEARS. i guess by recording 12 months of time i may be able to decode back to the SR, natal and maybe if i am a good girl the LR

Look for your revolutions throught your life, then to the SR of your friends, and try to get a grisp.

Good idea

My advice: never use the SR as stand alone technique

Point taken, i guess with practice i will be more at ease to combine any type and or predictive tools.

So to tom, thank you for your kind warning , Yuzuru for your advice and RC to spot my french translation RS (Revolution solaire ) instead of SR (solar return)

Going back to read Morin but this time really slowly

Oh yes i am also glad that sql was sorted out, now we can bombarb the system with 1 million question and specially moi.

I have found Morin's methods of treating solar returns to be very accurate.

i do not have any doubts when i read Anthony's book every comments made whether by his own experiences and or revealing the tools of other astrologues seem so logical. But i guess it takes a lot of calmness and dexterity to consolidate all (i.e natal chart, SR, LR, progression etc)

I am fascinated with Morin, the way it describes the sign, debilities, and the impact when he introduces the relation with the natal chart. This add some frustration in my learning. What he see i can't, i guess i do not look closely the full picture.

Additionally, i may have combined too many views of various writers!! and lost myself with all
But i am still searching for the trigger and when it happens than i will say "now i understand"

It is far easier to see things that have happened than it is to see what is going to happen. In order to do this, we need some context.

I do agree, maybe i should rewind my knowledge and start with the basic and complement my understanding with what I know (i.e past events) i can't go wrong hopefully

They give the nativity little more than lip service and concentrate mainly on what houses fall where in the nativity without regard to the meaning of the nativity

i could not denie that, i have so many books on the floor that only concentrate on the meaning of the house and where the planet falls without complying as to whether those elements are rock solid in the natal chart and or as to whether it can be traced in the natal chart..

and maybe that why i may need to when doing a SR that it should be placed in inner wheel and natal outer hence avoiding to ignore the birth chart

And maybe i should minimise to investigate and or try to explain all details until i only focus on prime and dominant characteristics of the chart (i work with numbers all day so it does not help ).

On the side of my irritating mind, it's a pleasure to work closely with members of this site. From my personal experience, this site has provided rich and wonderfull expertise from members and sometimes they do pull me back to earth

so many thanks for your support




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