17
Yes, Doublegem, this "your" chart is very reliable if we look progressed Moon and Solar returns.
He was married, as I remeber, in July 1999. For that year progressed Moon was in 7 house, quite Ok for this event. Solar return for this year gets 10th house (tehnical 9 house at the end)on ASC, change of status, with solar Moon in conjuct with MC, solar ruler Sa in 3rd house with Su, and natal ruler Sa in 6th house. 3rd house is Ok, because there are more events with cousins when you marry, and 6th house maybe in that year he signed for Manch. Un.?
For the year of his transfer to Real, July 2003, progressed Moon was in his 10th house (change in career) quite appropriate!
His solar return gets 9house(!) on ASC, foreigner country, with solar Sa right on DSC, get public attention, and natal Sa in 6 house, day to day routine! Su in this chart is right on IC emphasize his new home.
Greetings,
Goca
http://www.astrosport07.webs.com
http://fensi88.livejournal.com/

19
I can't see the chart with Mercury conjoining Ascendant in Taurus "working". Do we know if Beckham Snr was present at the birth? The only way I can get this sort of time to respect facts is with a slightly later time around 7.00 am, when Venus is in 1st, Saturn is in 2nd, Moon in 9th, Neptune conjoins Desc (!), Mars and Jupiter are in 10th, and Pluto in 5th. (Polich-Page houses).

21
Goca
Yes, that`s quite extraordinary, isn`t it, all these mutual receptions! They all seem to be benefiting each other in his case. Particularly the most obvious is the one on the AC--- Mercury in Taurus on Ac in mutual reception with Venus in Gemini on the 2nd cusp. He himself has quite a commercial value; he`s known for his good looks and has made a lot of money advertising commercial products.

Coder
I don`t know how you reached your conclusion but can someone as loaded as Becks have Saturn in the 2nd!?

22
I don`t know how you reached your conclusion but can someone as loaded as Becks have Saturn in the 2nd!?
It would make perfect sense if he felt that he never had enough. From what little I know of him, it appears that he is always chasing the money and is prepared to move his family continually to seek more and more of it. Saturn in the 2nd house could leave him feeling like he is restricted financially regardless of whether others view it otherwise. It may leave him with a disparity between what he has and what he thinks he should have.

But the 2nd house is not only about finances but what you value. The restrictions may have nothing to do with money.

23
I just got an email from AstroDatabank for their chart of the month and it is David Beckham. They have his time as 6:17am quoted by several noted astrologers such as Frank Clifford and Sy Scholfield. There is a copy of his birth certificate in the book by his father. You probably can't get more exact than that.

The chart that they have up is an equal houses chart. It is fairly similar to some of Coder's speculations, for example, Saturn in the 2nd house. However, using Placidus, he has a Gemini ascendant with Saturn in the 3rd.

http://www.astrodatabank.com/NM/BeckhamDavid.htm

24
Strange... The data in the AstroDataBank newspaper has got the same time as the one I gave earlier but the chart printed there has got the wrong ASC(Gemini).
The AC should be in Taurus and Saturn is definitely in the 3rd.
In their 'What Do YOu Think' section, they mention he's got Moon at the last degree of Capricorn yet the chart there has Aquarius Moon.
Last edited by Gem on Fri Jan 26, 2007 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

25
doublegem,

This chart is done in what they have called GDT time. I wondered if this meant something like Greenwich Daylight Time, the same as British Summer Time. However, they have the time at 0:00hrs, which is definitely GMT. It appears that the time for this chart would be 6:17 BST, not GMT as AstroDatabank appear to have it.

26
Hi Sue
As far as I can remember, Frank Clifford said that DB had the AC in Taurus.
And to comment on what you said earlier:

[quote]But the 2nd house is not only about finances but what you value. The restrictions may have nothing to do with money.


True but it does also show the conditions of the native's finances.

27
There is a copy of his birth certificate in the book by his father. You probably can't get more exact than that.
First, there is no requirement in the UK to record times of birth. The recording of a time of birth eo ipso stands in need of some explanation in my view. (It might, for example, knowing astrologers' propensities to sniff around the horoscopes of the rich and famous, have been designed (after the event) to mislead. Can we be really certain that the copy reproduced in the book is a true facsimile of the original record?). Second, pace the arguments over Gauquelin, is the question, salient in those countries (e.g. France) where birth times are recorded, but relevant to the general issue of recording birth times, whether they are recorded correctly, or whether there is some systematic error or bias (not necessarily intentional). Third, there is the astrological-philosophical question of the precise time at which the natal horoscope is to be considered as "switched on". Fourth, house systems are an ongoing open question. Fifth, repeating a falsehood does not make it true or acceptable, merely more accepted. Sixth, while it is possible to convince oneself that a purported birth-time is correct by scoring enough "hits" using progressions and direction to "significant" life events, if you want to convince me of this you will need also to repeat the same progressions and directions for alternative candidate birth times to show me that your candidate is the best one. In the absence of that, I think the requirement must be that a natal chart show a general fit with the native.
[2nd house] does also show the conditions of the native's finances.
This begs the question: when? now? last year? etc. It's true that from some horoscopes we can deduce conditions pertaining specifically at death birth or birth (e.g. Pluto rising and a tenous grip on life in the first weeks), and that this can include judgements as to whether the native is born or dies either wealthy or impoverished. It can also show whether the native's fortunes improve or diminish in life, either steadily or suddenly. Until we are in position to read the epitaphs, we need to be careful to avoid rushing to judgement.

Lacking complete knowledge of Beckham's finances in the future, it seems to me we are on a surer footing (;)) with psychology, since talents, deep motivations, and so on, tend to remain more constant in a person's life than his/her financial position. Sue's reply on my behalf about the possibility of a 2nd house Saturn (thanks, Sue) is along these lines, and has affinities with Adler's terms "superiority complex" and "inferiority complex". Of course I am not ascribing one or other to Beckham: when a perceived lack acts as a stimulus to achievement, that cannot by itself be termed a "complex" or considered pathological in any way.

Finally, there is the (self-evident? beginners?) point that Saturn represent's the natives father (in one of his guises), and we know that Beckham did not come from a wealthy background.