I think the drama will come to end next year because of a 3 degree opposition from solar Moon to solar sun
There's a Venus Neptune Conjunction the foreground, just barely, and natal Venus will be partile the West Point! Once again his natal Venus/Pluto/Saturn Planetary triplet will be in the foreground on the angles
ASC/DSC
Then again in 2013 transiting Mars/Saturn will be angular and squaring eachother! With the same natal planets once again in the foreground!
Even though I don't envy his problems I wish transiting Venus would smile on me a lot sooner than 2012

I was not trying to be judgemental or anything, If I were a semi-pro, and this were my client I would show the same level of concern.
What really gets to me is the fact that some day this kid will be an adult, probably with the same problems, he'll be 18 and the native won't be able to do anything really to abate this behavior, and you know mothers are blind with thier children! Even if a child is bad, a mother will overlook almost anything short of murder, and the native will probably be trapped in the middle.
I knew a group of children like this in highschool, and most of them have not changed in the least 26 years old, no job, harassing people, smoking weed. I know the native has a good heart, but it's usually the people with good hearts that are vulnurable to being used, abused, ect.......just because they love someone. My mother is exactly the same way= Natal Venus bodily on an angle, and she bends over for people indiscriminately...I have to reign her in sometimes.

Hi BiBi, this is a difficult situation for the native. His 2011 Solar Return clearly foretells a crisis pertaining to Venus (Love)?but we all have various crises throughout our lives.

Steve

Steve, I think you've covered a lot of the book. Jim did not write that much about death of the native in Solar Returns, but he did focus on Elvis' final chart and how often when death comes around Jupiter is involved!

BiBi wrote:

I think you've covered a lot of the book. Jim did not write that much about death of the native in Solar Returns, but he did focus on Elvis' final chart and how often when death comes around Jupiter is involved!

Jupiter is prominent in many death charts. This is somewhat perplexing. It appears to be symbolizing some type of happy release or an expansion of one?s consciousness. Death is a huge mystery of life?it happens to all yet we do not actually understand what it means.

Steve

I am using my own 2011 chart, it looks pretty dynamic, I wanted to deleniate this chart to possibly help others navigate through their future returns with the information they have available to them via their current surroundings! I wouldn't suggest reading a chart 10-20 years from now, as several things could change, you could die, get married, move....if you want to read a future chart I would say even 5-10 years into the future only rely on lunar aspects, and partile aspects! Be Very General as the angles could change with life's circumstances!

Anyway, for 2011 Mars is 5 degrees and 58 away from the IC indicating domestic strife confrontation ego, one'd needs over others are pronounced during this period

Saturn is 3 degrees and 2 minutes away from the West point, but closer in mundo so I will count it as such!
Obviously Saturn on an auxilary angle is still pronounced, and being on the west point will probably mean inhibition provoked possible by other people.

Tr Pluto and Tr Uranus are squaring my natal Venus and Jupiter in partile configuration! Tough to interpret, but I will give it a whirl Pluto Sq Natal Venus Seperation from a loved one possibly dramatic! Uarnus Square Jupiter Change of luck! This is in the background, it's partile so it will probably affect me, but not that much, but with Solar Moon Progressing to a conjunction to Pluto but an inuitial square to Jupiter it will be much more intense, it will affect both my natal and solar Planenets, the first hit will be probably be nice, but the second one will not be! Overall this year will probably be bad.
Natal Moon is also on the MC
Receptive Impressionable and Vulnurable.....Just a few words from Jim's book
My mother's health is somewhat bad, and she has a terrible boyfriend which I hate...I hope it has nothing to do with that!

Hi Steve

Since this thread is now nearly 14 pages long, I think it would be a good idea to resolve any final points and bring this particular discussion to a close. The reason is that it is now very difficult for new members to come in and follow this discussion, or contribute to this thread. But of course your discussions can continue in a new thread which has a new emphasis - I just feel it would be better now to start a new discussion at a point at which new members can begin to follow the points being made, (perhaps with an opening link being made to this post ?)

Best wishes
Deb

Gosh Deb, I am sorry, I hope I didn't post too much here.
It is time to start a new thread possibly on Western Sidereal Astrology in general?
Or maybe we can find another outlet to continue this discussion?

Hi Bibi

Never fear about posting too much, that's not a problem Also, I'm not about to close the thread - just giving my opinion that it will probably be better to start thinking about closing this one now, since it is getting so long. It can run for a bit longer if you like, but I don't think it is good for anyone if threads extend beyond, say 15 pages, because anyone who misses the discussion at the start won't be able to 'catch up'. Either of your suggestions are fine with me.

Best wishes
Deb

Hi Deb & BiBi,

I agree with Deb. This thread has become too long and would be difficult for new members to follow its discussion. There is not much more I can add to this thread as far as important teaching/learning points. Basically, I have achieved my objective with this thread by trying to pass-on and preserving some important astrological knowledge for future interested astrologers. So I will end this thread.

I may later start a new thread titled ?SoLunars? offering further select Solar & Lunar Return chart examples as taught by the Western Siderealists. I also may later write an index to this long thread to help interested members reference certain chart examples with certain teaching techniques.

Regards, Steve

Deb, before you lock this thread for good, could you please share your opinion on the methods and results that were displayed in this thread?
Just like Steve, I also respect your opinion a lot, and it would be good to hear from you on this.
I know you're a dedicated tropicalist, but you can still use these methods with tropical astrology.

Good news for the astrologers who are interested in Solar Returns as explained on this thread and a link back to certain astrological teachings from the western siderealist movement in the 40's, 50's & 60's. Jim Eshelman's forum site and author of ?Interpreting Solar Returns? is back online after a one year absence. S

http://www.solunars.net/

I read Eshelman's, Fagan's etc books, but many things were unclear. Working through the first two pages of this thread, recreating all the charts, taught me how this system works!

Good Work! Thanks!