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Suggestions?: Translation of Christian Astrology into Urdu

 
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Morpheus



Joined: 21 Mar 2007
Posts: 764
Location: Rawalpindi/Islamabad (Pakistan)

Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:27 am    Post subject: Suggestions?: Translation of Christian Astrology into Urdu Reply with quote

Dear All,

I have decided to translate Volume I & II into Urdu (National language of Pakistan). Since it would be my first attempt in translating any text I would appreciate any suggestions.

I would take not more than 3 years, translating on weekends. From the commercial point of view the venture would be in loss as the most popular book in Pakistan can not sell more than few thousands. So, its just for promoting correct, sane and complete book on Horary Astrology and nothing else.
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Morpheus

https://horusastropalmist.wordpress.com/
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johannes susato



Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Posts: 1464

Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Splendid idea, Horatio, congratulations! Thumbs up Very Happy Thumbs up Very Happy Thumbs up Very Happy

All the best and best of all wishes for translating THE Lilly.

Johannes
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lihin



Joined: 14 Dec 2009
Posts: 470
Location: Mount Kailash

Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:38 pm    Post subject: Name dangereous? Reply with quote

Good afternoon,

Although it has been discussed here at the forum to what extent, if any, the content of Mr William Lilly's book is 'Christian', might the use of this title give rise to cultural misunderstandings in Pakistan?

To avoid problems would it perhaps be useful to put a clarifying translator's note at the front of the volume, stating something like, had Mr Lilly resided in Turkey rather than in England, the title might have been 'Islamic'?

Best regards,

lihin
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Morpheus



Joined: 21 Mar 2007
Posts: 764
Location: Rawalpindi/Islamabad (Pakistan)

Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi lihin,

Christian Astrology is the name of the book and William Lilly is the author. Cant avoid it. People are too smart to google it. The astrology in general is frowned upon by the religious clerks, but if people like me are alive it means that perhaps we can experiment a bit.

I wonder if religious clerics might honour me by saying that Horatio has been the only one to correctly research the roots of astrology back to Christians.

Less than 10% of our population is interested in reading books Secret
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Morpheus

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Morpheus



Joined: 21 Mar 2007
Posts: 764
Location: Rawalpindi/Islamabad (Pakistan)

Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hummm....

Lets translate the title of the Book

Nusrani Najoom Smile
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Morpheus

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Nixx



Joined: 10 Dec 2011
Posts: 295

Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Horatio wrote:
Hi lihin,

Christian Astrology is the name of the book and William Lilly is the author. Cant avoid it. People are too smart to google it. The astrology in general is frowned upon by the religious clerks, but if people like me are alive it means that perhaps we can experiment a bit.

I wonder if religious clerics might honour me by saying that Horatio has been the only one to correctly research the roots of astrology back to Christians.
Less than 10% of our population is interested in reading books Secret


Let's hope not as the 'roots' of Astrology go back a long time before Christianity reared it's peculiar, or Piscean, face. More simply the idea of believing in Jesus, regardless as to whether or not he existed and if he did how his life panned out, seems to be an irrelvance to Western Astrologers today, and early doors. As far as I know this would be the case in Indian Astro circles as well.
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Morpheus



Joined: 21 Mar 2007
Posts: 764
Location: Rawalpindi/Islamabad (Pakistan)

Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Nixx,

There are few astrologers in Pakistan who practice Vedic Astrology. The majority in our country have founded their practice consciously or unconsciously on Khorasani astrology (Persian). As far as Muslim point of view is concerned an indirect reference is made in Quran about 'Abraham the prophet' using astrology.
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Morpheus

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james_m



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
Posts: 3537
Location: vancouver island

Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

horatio,

good luck in bringing your idea to fruition. sounds like a lot of work to me! i would imagine some of the book publishers of astrology in india would be interested in publishing your work. many people in india also speak urdu. all the best in your idea here!
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lihin



Joined: 14 Dec 2009
Posts: 470
Location: Mount Kailash

Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 6:06 pm    Post subject: Precautions and possible alternative? Reply with quote

Good evening,

Well, Mr Horatio, if in your situation i should not risk serious eventual problems with religious authorities, especially if only quite few people might read the book anyway. You might try to 'take the bull by the horns' and submit the project to a arch-conservative but well educated and well known theologian. Even if he disagrees with 'Christian astrology', he might still understand the project and basically approve it, thus becoming a valuable reference in case of later difficulties.

What Chapter and Verse of the Quran have you referred to in your last post, please?

If publication of the translation would imply important risks for you, perhaps an Urdu translation of Abu'l Rayhan Muhammad ibn Ahmad Al-Biruni's excellent The Book of Instruction in the Elements of the Art of Astrology might be an alternative, although this book should be translated directly from the original Arabic into Urdu, if this has not yet been done.

By no means should you be discouraged but yours truly and probably other forum members would be unhappy to learn that harm befell you due to your project.

Best regards,

lihin
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Morpheus



Joined: 21 Mar 2007
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Location: Rawalpindi/Islamabad (Pakistan)

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi lihin,

Thanks for your concerns. You are raising very important points.

I have family connections which protect me.

I have talked with some of my fundamentalist connections. They are of the opinion that translation of William Lilly is a harmless and issue less project for them. One of my connection remarked last night that William Lilly by the choice of the name for his book appears to be a religious person.

Abu Rehan, Mashallah and Abu Maashar belong to the Khorasani category of astrologers. Ancient Khorasan included Northren Iran, Afghanistan, Turkeministan etc. Persian had been the State Language for Pakistan/India for many centuries. We are familiar with Persian and Arabic but not with Latin. The books of Khorasani astrologers are available.

BTW, there is a difference between Abu Rehan book and William Lilly book. Rehan book concentrates on primary points and definitions, whereas Lilly's Book is the best single book on Horary one can have and I am speaking from the Muslim/Pakistani point of view too.

I am in a Guest room right now, once I have Quran I would give the reference.
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Morpheus



Joined: 21 Mar 2007
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Location: Rawalpindi/Islamabad (Pakistan)

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Johannes for your encouragement. No doubt. Its THE Lilly Thumbs up

James, Hindi and Urdu are similar in many ways. Its the script which is different. Urdu is written in Arabic/Persian script while Hindi is written in Devnagri script. Quite a problem. Smile
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Morpheus

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Morpheus



Joined: 21 Mar 2007
Posts: 764
Location: Rawalpindi/Islamabad (Pakistan)

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi lihin,

More information about Urdu that it has origin in Persian and Turkish and people speaking urdu should be comfortable with persian. So my reason for not translating Arabic or Persian text.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urdu


Information about Khorasan. My ancestors belong from Mashad and Merv.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_Khorasan


Its Surah number 37 'Assafat' and Verses number 83 to 92. It appears that Abraham's family is insisting him to attend something. In hte opinion of the astrologer from which I have taken. They wanted him to attend the festival of Ishtarat. Abraham wanted to make an excuse.......


So here is the translation. Forgive me for my bad English


"...and no doubt Abraham followed him (Noah). And when he attended before his God with good intentions and he said to his father and his Nation. Are these Idols you pray to? Forgetting the true God and asking from the man-made? What do you exactly think about God? And he Looked into Stars and said " I am going to be sick" (an excuse). They left him and went their way. So Abraham secretly sneaked into Idols room and said " Why dont you eat?....................."
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lihin



Joined: 14 Dec 2009
Posts: 470
Location: Mount Kailash

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:02 pm    Post subject: Best wishes! Reply with quote

Good afternoon,

Mr Horatio, i wish you the best possible circumstances and success for your translation, its publication and readership. Indeed it is widely recognised that Mr William Lilly's book is amongst the best on horary astrology.

Abu'l Rayhan Muhammad ibn Ahmad Al-Biruni's book is one of the best i know from any period on astronomy, mathematics (2/3) and astrology (1/3). He often mentioned techniques from India.

The region of Khorasan has indeed been very productive of outstanding scholars in many fields. Dr. Benjamin Dykes has translated several Persian astrologers' books, mostly written or preserved in Arabic, into English in three volumes of Persian Nativities.

Best regards,

lihin
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Morpheus



Joined: 21 Mar 2007
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Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi lihin,

Thanks for the encouraging words. Indeed Benjamin Dykes is doing a wonderful work. I admire his energy and dedication Thumbs up
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Morpheus

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