Ok, a friend of mins is in a bit of a dilemma. She is seeing a guy, but likes another guy as well! Her question is "Will I get together with this man?"

I have set a chart for 22nd December 2004, 11:44am, 51N33 0E43.


The chart has Pisces rising, and she just happens to be a Pisces. She is represented by Jupiter which is in Libra in the 7th house. The quesited is ruled by Mercury, which is in sagittarius in the 8th house, but on the 9th house cusp. I have decided to read this as being in the 9th house, as the man in question is going abroad in the new year. The significators seem to show a mutual attraction. although they are not in aspect, Mercury will sextile Jupiter in about 5.10 degrees time. I would read this as a positive answer, but I notice that saturn is in the 5th house - not good for romance, although it is the ruler of her hopes and wishes. Could this mean that she gets her wish, but only after some difficulty or delay?Jupiter and Venus are in mutual reception, and this leads me to think that Venus represents her current boyfriend. The Moon is going to quincunx Jupiter which i beleive means that some changes will have to be made before things can proceed. As Jupiter is her significator, am I right in thinking that it is she who has to make adjustments (ie finish with her current boyfriend?). Because of the mutual reception between Venus and Jupiter i suspect she does not really want to finish with her current boyfriend. However, the situation with the quesited has been going on for a while, and they have been out on a few dates, before the querent met her current squeeze. The quesited has messed her about a bit in the past, so is Mercury in detriment telling us that she should keep awy from this man? The final aspect from the moon is an opposition to mars. This looks to me like some kind of fight. Possibly between the two men?

Anyone got any thoughts on this?

Hi Pocket Dragon,

If you check out your ephemeris you'll find that Venus overtakes Mercury and perfects its sextile to Jupiter before Mercury does. So if Venus represents your friend's current boyfriend, on a cursory glance it looks like he gets (or rather keeps) the girl.

Venus' conjunction with Mercury might represent the time when the rivals meet, perhaps. Mercury is in detriment in Sagittarius and although direct and in her sign is moving slowly in this chart so is not in a strong position in relation to the question. Whereas Venus and Jupiter are both strengthened by their mutual reception (which also shows they love each other in a genuine way).

Added to which Jupiter is in its own terms, Saturn's triplicity, face and exaltation, suggesting she doesn't have any real feelings for Mercury.

I didn't spend long looking at the chart but I'd say the indications are pretty strong that the current boyfriend "wins".

jupRx

Thanks for you comments Juprx.

She did say that she was starting to 'go off' this other guy, so that is consistent with what you say about Jupiter being in it's in own ters and triplicity, etc of Saturn. I guess the fact that it is in the quesited's house suggests she does have some feelings for him. We had a christmas party last week, and she did say she was nervous about bumping into him. Her current boyfriend was nervous about her going as well! I was also petrified as I was going to bump into the guy I like, but if you look at my update on my old thread, you will see it went ok, and I went away happy!

Thanks for your help.

You're welcome.

I saw your post on the other thread, hope things work out for you in the end, at least you know more about the situation now and it seems to be consistent with the first horary.

jupRx

I agree with everything that's been said, but I also couldn't help but wonder if her current real boyfriend might not be the 7th house ruler Mercury and her new interest might be Venus.

I am not sure there is a way to tell one way or the other. This problem seems to come up a fair amount, where someone is very much involved or even living with someone, but they are all in a fluster about someone they don't even know that well. It could be argued that the one that they are involved with for real is the 7th house ruler, and the one they are tantalized by is shown not by house rulership, but if it all, by reception and aspect. Again, I am not sure how to decide which one to use. On one hand, the person asking the question's head is filled with thoughts of this new person, so that argues for assigning the new person to the 7th house. On the other side, their real life is with their current boyfriend or husband, so that would argue to assign them to the 7th house.

Anyone else have any thoughts about this? I am sure we've all seen this situation before.

Another question I have is what could the fact Venus rules the 2nd house mean? There is some emphasis on the 2nd - 8th house axis, as Venus is in the 8th house and rules the 2nd and the Moon will be opposite Mars from the 2nd - 8th house axis. Can the 2nd house mean not possessions in the literal sense and maybe instead self worth, or possessiveness? Or maybe it could just be a plain or fight about money.

The main fact of this chart is that before Jupiter (the lady) and Mercury meet, Venus (whoever or whatever that may be) meets up with Mercury, and only after that do Jupiter and Mercury get together. This is a great example of prohibition by aspect. Venus blocks Mercury and Jupiter from getting together.

PS - I forgot to being out on point that stands out a lot.

There may be a lot of hidden secrets from the past here. A bady debilitated Saturn is retrograde in the 5th house and rules the 12th house. Both Uranus and Neptune are in the 12th house. Jupiter is applying to a trine with Neptune. The woman here is obviously confused Mercury is also applying to a sextile with Neptune, and the Moon is separating from a square with it as well, so confusion reigns here.

Hi Mark,

it's a good point, especially since there was some history between the querent and the quesited before she met her current boyfriend.
Also you can't always rely on the question which is asked being the one which is really on the querent's mind.

Thinking about the chart again another possibility could be that Saturn could be the current boyfriend (mutual exaltation with Jupiter but detrimental to Jupiter because of Saturn's debilitated state), since Saturn often seems to represent the "incumbent" in a relationship, and if you take Venus to be the joint significator of the querent (natural ruler of women) and Mercury to be the new interest it could be that the Venus-Mercury conjunction is the important aspect in relation to the question.

A couple of other points I noticed about the chart, Saturn Rx applies to trine the Ascendant (the querent) very soon; and I wonder who or what the Sun represents - although peregrine it's strongly placed on the MC and has just moved into Saturn's sign from Jupiter's (the querent's).

any thoughts ?

all in all the picture maybe isn't as clear as it looked at first

jupRx