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how to interpret two contradicting houses of same lord

 
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bowly



Joined: 26 Jul 2013
Posts: 9

Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 12:29 pm    Post subject: how to interpret two contradicting houses of same lord Reply with quote

learned members had a question



have seen that sometimes two houses of same lord in a chart maybe in a good and a bad house..



say Capricorn in 5th and aquarius in 6th with 5th lord Saturn in 10th house..what will be saturns role in such a scenario



similarly Gemini in 6th house and virgo in 9th house..which house will decide how mercury plays out..



5th house saggi and 8th house pisces..Jupiter becomes a benefic or be adverse..



help appreciated,
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Kenneth Johnson



Joined: 12 Aug 2012
Posts: 132
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA

Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 11:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is no simple formula for this. Each example needs to be taken on a case by case basis.

For example, if Virgo is rising and Saturn is in the Tenth, then both the lord of the 5th and 6th will be in the 10th, but both houses (5 and 6) will yield good results because Saturn, a malefic, does well in the 10th, which is an upachaya house.

Since your other examples do not include the house positions for Mercury and Jupiter, it isn't possible to say how they will work out. One general guideline is that wherever they may be located, Mercury will be somewhat stronger in its role of 9th House ruler rather than 6th. Jupiter will be somewhat stronger as the 5th house ruler rather than 8th. This is because of a rule known as mulatrikona, which identifies the stronger rulership among planets that rule two signs.
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bowly



Joined: 26 Jul 2013
Posts: 9

Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hey Kenneth thank you for ur reply

for virgo asc Jupiter becomes badhaka due to 4th n 7th lordship..

does being in 5th house and debilitated nullify any effects of kendradhipati yog

Kenneth Johnson wrote:
There is no simple formula for this. Each example needs to be taken on a case by case basis.

For example, if Virgo is rising and Saturn is in the Tenth, then both the lord of the 5th and 6th will be in the 10th, but both houses (5 and 6) will yield good results because Saturn, a malefic, does well in the 10th, which is an upachaya house.

Since your other examples do not include the house positions for Mercury and Jupiter, it isn't possible to say how they will work out. One general guideline is that wherever they may be located, Mercury will be somewhat stronger in its role of 9th House ruler rather than 6th. Jupiter will be somewhat stronger as the 5th house ruler rather than 8th. This is because of a rule known as mulatrikona, which identifies the stronger rulership among planets that rule two signs.
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Stefan



Joined: 31 May 2012
Posts: 122
Location: Stockholm

Posted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A planet with two rulers if afflicted or badly placed, can tip to the negative ruled house.
On the contrary a nicely placed planet, can have a tendency to tip to the positive house ruled more.
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bowly



Joined: 26 Jul 2013
Posts: 9

Posted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jupiter rules the 5th house...but the sign Capricorn makes it deb..what do we go with

Stefan wrote:
A planet with two rulers if afflicted or badly placed, can tip to the negative ruled house.
On the contrary a nicely placed planet, can have a tendency to tip to the positive house ruled more.
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Stefan



Joined: 31 May 2012
Posts: 122
Location: Stockholm

Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kenneth Johnson wrote
Quote:
There is no simple formula for this. Each example needs to be taken on a case by case basis


I feel Kenneth have a point here generally speaking. The whole chart have to be looked at.
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pankajdubey



Joined: 17 Nov 2006
Posts: 1215
Location: Delhi

Posted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bowly wrote:
hey Kenneth thank you for ur reply

for virgo asc Jupiter becomes badhaka due to 4th n 7th lordship..

does being in 5th house and debilitated nullify any effects of kendradhipati yog


Kendradhipatya gets cancelled when the planet is in own sign in that kendra.
eg: if Jupiter was in sagittarius in 4th.

Here, you have to look for
Quote:
neechabhanga
or cancellation of debility of Jupiter.

Good thing is jupiter does aspect the ascendant with 9th full aspect- so searching for any secondary strength would be important.

PD
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bowly



Joined: 26 Jul 2013
Posts: 9

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 9:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pankajdubey wrote:
bowly wrote:
hey Kenneth thank you for ur reply

for virgo asc Jupiter becomes badhaka due to 4th n 7th lordship..

does being in 5th house and debilitated nullify any effects of kendradhipati yog


Kendradhipatya gets cancelled when the planet is in own sign in that kendra.
eg: if Jupiter was in sagittarius in 4th.

Here, you have to look for
Quote:
neechabhanga
or cancellation of debility of Jupiter.

Good thing is jupiter does aspect the ascendant with 9th full aspect- so searching for any secondary strength would be important.

PD


thank you for ur reply pankaj ji..

I did not understand the statement"searching for any secondary strength would be important"

can u explain pls
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pankajdubey



Joined: 17 Nov 2006
Posts: 1215
Location: Delhi

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@bowly

-Like being exalted or in own sign in navamsha.
Capricorn jupiter could well be in pisces or in cancer navamsha.

-Neecha bhanga rajayoga.

-Jupiter's points in own Ashtakvarga or Sarvashtaka varga.

PD
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dragonqueen



Joined: 22 Jun 2013
Posts: 196

Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

V K Choudry deems Saturn rules Aquarius house but not Capricorn,Mercury Virgo but not Gemini.
I personally dont get his logic.He calls the ruled sign Mooltrikoona
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Kenneth Johnson



Joined: 12 Aug 2012
Posts: 132
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA

Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 8:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't always "get" Choudhry either.

Mulatrikona (lit. "root trine") is a classical rule. If a planet rules two signs, one will always be slightly more powerful than the other. Hence Aquarius rather than Capricorn is Saturn's mulatrikona, while Virgo rather than Gemini plays the same role for Mercury.

So, in the example of a horoscope with Sagittarius rising, the 3rd House will carry more impact than the 2nd because Aquarius is Saturn's mulatrikona. The 10th will have more impact than the 7th because Virgo is Mercury's mulatrikona.

This ancient rule is valuable because it helps us to establish emphasis, as well as more accurately assessing the effects of the time lords. In a Mercury period for a Sag rising person, for example, we may expect 10th House issues to be somewhat more notable than 7th House issues.

Where Choudhry differs from the classics is in tossing out the rulership of the secondary house altogether and retaining only the mulatrikona rulership.

I cannot follow his reasoning.
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Rohiniranjan



Joined: 07 Sep 2013
Posts: 3
Location: Ottawa

Posted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 10:58 pm    Post subject: Re: how to interpret two contradicting houses of same lord Reply with quote

bowly wrote:
learned members had a question



have seen that sometimes two houses of same lord in a chart maybe in a good and a bad house..



say Capricorn in 5th and aquarius in 6th with 5th lord Saturn in 10th house..what will be saturns role in such a scenario



similarly Gemini in 6th house and virgo in 9th house..which house will decide how mercury plays out..



5th house saggi and 8th house pisces..Jupiter becomes a benefic or be adverse..



help appreciated,



Hi Bowly,

There are diverse opinions on this matter and a few others that others have mentioned. Regarding dual rulership (thank god only 5 and not all 7 are influenced by this duality! Lights are spared and nodes create another set of opinions regarding rulership or not (as too their aspects or drishtis!).

What I have heard are primarily these:
= If rising sign is odd then the odd sign has an edge (for leo rising, sagittarius has the edge, if taurus rises pisces gets the preference).

= Moolatrikona (principle trine) has the edge over the other sign. This is corroborated also in the strength determination rules where MT has a leg over the other sign)

Regarding badhakasthana (C-11, M-7, F=9), the 'space' is obstructive, but not the 'inn-keeper' :-)
Some maintain that inn-keeper (ruler of badhaka house) is problematical if also the ruler of the 22nd drekkana or 64th navamsha or otherwise vitiated (dont'cha just adore those ominious-sounding labels?). Additionally, in the case of badhakasthana, the planet residing there and thus considered afflicted -- their chara-karakattwa seems to get obstructed more than their house lordship. This seems to be also more pertinent in the case of karako-bhav naashaay concept. If moon is matrikaraka (chara consideration) and placed in 4th there will be problems experienced in relationship with mother, as in difficult or unavailability for relating to, etc. Sometimes even worse.

I don't know if all of these are merely anecdotal or empirical (observation-based) or arise from some scriptural origins. It seems, as per statements made by scholars and researchers (in scriptures) or at least more knowledgeable folks, there are many ancient pieces of literature in Jyotish that remain unpublished or widely available, yet. I have not administered these folks truth serum or put them through a LDT, so cannot sign any affidavits as to the veracity of these claims/statements, so essentially, if you like it and it works for you, "keep it", or else simply 'toss'! <SIGH>

Love and Light,

Rohiniranjan
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J K Sharma



Joined: 23 Dec 2007
Posts: 45

Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 5:44 pm    Post subject: When a Planet owns two Signs Reply with quote

Mars, Mercury, Jupiter, Venus and Saturn: these 5 Planets own two signs each. Like Mars owns Aries and Scorpio. Aries is Mooltrikona Sign of Mars. If we look on elementary nature of these two signs of Mars, both are totally different like Aries is a Fiery Sign while Scorpio is Watery Sign. Also both are in 1-8 placement (also known as Shadastak). Depending on characteristics, Aries is considered as Active Sign and Scorpio as Passive. Aries Mars practice much masculine features while Scorpion Mars is of Feminine features along with more emotions.

Same way. other 4 planets have one active Sign and other Passive Sign.

As Laghu Parashari, Asc play an important to judge the results multiple signs of a Planet. According to each Asc...the House wise Placement differs. Like, if a Planet owns one Kendra Sign and one Trine sign.. then such a Planet is considered Rajyoga Karka (or benefic).

Here, both Sign's placement as per houses occupied by them according to Asc... act as a guide tool for results experienced by them. Further Planet's own placement with respect to each Sign/House and from Asc become important factor.

JK
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