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Domicile rulership in the sidereal zodiac
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james_m



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
Posts: 2707
Location: vancouver island

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

martin,

i think you have got it right.. it is essentially the sun moving 40 degrees or 1/9th of the circle forward with the resulting charts off it's position all connected directly to the suns natal position.

in order to get this via solar fire - my version is 7.3
highlight the solar return chart for the particular year.
go to ->returns and ingresses. then -> in the options menu select advanced return selections.. choose sun - 9th harmonic with the sun position data in the box asking for this.. it will generate 9 charts that are essentially transit charts that coincide with where the sun will be every 40 degrees or approx 40 days from the primary solar return for the particular year. i am not sure how this works in other versions of solar fire..
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Therese Hamilton



Joined: 22 Feb 2011
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Location: California, USA

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Martin Gansten wrote:
Quote:
I think I get it now: it's not a harmonic (in the ordinary sense), but a division of the year into nine equal parts as measured by the Sun's motion. It is thus a variant on the practice of dividing the year into twelve equal solar months (which could be called 'dodecads'). Well, I'll look at it and see if anything useful emerges.

Yes, that's it Martin. I'm sorry I couldn't explain it more clearly. James Eshelman writes that Donald Bradley experimented with the 12 solar months, but some failed miserably unless they coincided with the Enneads. That's how Bradley discovered the value of the ninth division of the year.

Anyway our western astrology programs call this ninth division a ninth harmonic. Actually with that choice we don't even have to calculate the solar return, but can type in any date and get the ninth chart of the year for that date. But it's best to refer back to the possibilities shown in the revolution which is also the first Ennead of the year.
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james_m



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
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Location: vancouver island

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

just a quick note.. it will generate 8, not 9 charts. the first chart is the solar return to it's natal position.. the 9th chart would be the following years solar return.. it generates 8 charts..
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Therese Hamilton



Joined: 22 Feb 2011
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Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

James wrote:
Quote:
i am following your discussion on the enneads with great interest.. i have solar fire 7.3. but i am unable to generate the charts you are showing here in the program i have.. perhaps i am missing something..

James, let me know if Pankaj has solved this problem for you.

May I respectfully ask why you don't use capital letter when you type? Especially the small "i" beginning a sentence is rather unsettling. This makes reading a little more difficult without the visual break of capital letters. Call me a stickler for details, (and too easily annoyed) but I wonder why no caps?
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Martin Gansten
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Joined: 05 Jul 2008
Posts: 1255
Location: Malmö, Sweden

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We've really gone off topic this time, haven't we? Very Happy I'll start a new thread on enneads if I find them useful, though so far I'm not thrilled -- transits and, to some extent, continuous profections still look like more reliable tools to me.
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Therese Hamilton



Joined: 22 Feb 2011
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Location: California, USA

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

James wrote:
Quote:
just a quick note.. it will generate 8, not 9 charts. the first chart is the solar return to it's natal position.. the 9th chart would be the following years solar return.. it generates 8 charts..

Yes, this is true. The first chart is the solar return or "King Ennead."

I don't know if the newer versions of Solar Fire allow you to use the outer chart cusps with another chart in the center as is necessary to easily read the Ennead and solar return. I have a special module designed by Matthew Quellas that gives this option. (Usually only the inner wheel cusps can be used for bi-wheels.)

I would be happy to share that module if it can be used with later versions of Solar Fire. You'd have to ask Astrolabe if the codes are the same.
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Therese Hamilton



Joined: 22 Feb 2011
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Location: California, USA

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Martin Gansten wrote:
Quote:
We've really gone off topic this time, haven't we? Very Happy I'll start a new thread on enneads if I find them useful, though so far I'm not thrilled -- transits and, to some extent, continuous profections still look like more reliable tools to me.

Well, Enneads are only cyclic transits set against the natal chart for a specific period of time. Profections: Yes, a great tool. Actually it would be good to see some examples of those if you have time to start a Profection thread, Martin. Profections haven't been much used here in North America.

Enneads: Often there is really nothing happening in those charts (little or no angularity), which should mean "life as usual" for that period of time. A promotion, a job coming through, the birth of a child, marriage....the Ennead should clearly show these types of events.

Domicile rulerships, the topic of this thread? Well, reading the solar return and cyclic charts such as the Ennead depend very much on house and domicile rulerships, so these charts can be used to confirm these traditional assignments.
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pankajdubey



Joined: 17 Nov 2006
Posts: 1215
Location: Delhi

Posted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 4:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just one thing to say before this thread closes- most of the confusion has occurred because of the terms used have been novel and not explained and the method individualistic.


BTW
I got the explanation for James' query from Therese's answer here:

http://www.indiadivine.org/content/topic/1443877-enneads-for-clintonobama/

Wink

Also, this thread shows the value of peer review and Frawley should join us- in a different forum of course.

PD
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Therese Hamilton



Joined: 22 Feb 2011
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Location: California, USA

Posted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 6:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pankajdubey wrote:

Quote:
BTW
I got the explanation for James' query from Therese's answer here:

http://www.indiadivine.org/content/topic/1443877-enneads-for-clintonobama/

You know what's scary?? I have absolutely no recollection of writing any of that. Sad
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pankajdubey



Joined: 17 Nov 2006
Posts: 1215
Location: Delhi

Posted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Therese,
Looks like Jim Eashelman is still active on this SoLunars forum.

http://www.solunars.net


I got this link from the last page of Steve's post(2010).
That thread ran for 15 pages.

http://skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5019&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
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Therese Hamilton



Joined: 22 Feb 2011
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Posted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pankajdubey wrote:
Quote:
Looks like Jim Eashelman is still active on this SoLunars forum. http://www.solunars.net

Yes, every so often I check Jim's forum for new posts. As far as I know Jim's forum is the only "live" venue for Fagan's astrology or the western sidereal system.
Quote:

I got this link from the last page of Steve's post(2010).
That thread ran for 15 pages.

http://skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5019&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

If there are serious students who want to learn techniques of the Fagan school, that thread will do it. There's an entire textbook in those posts.

Only I find it a little problematic that Steve generally uses the tropical zodiac while correcting for precession. But this may be the best way for tropical astrologers to become familiar with Fagan's techniques. This western school of sidereal astrology has had very few converts because the system is so mathematically intensive.
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