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significators going retro before exact aspect

 
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Venera



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 7

Posted: Sun Mar 20, 2005 5:17 am    Post subject: significators going retro before exact aspect Reply with quote

...the question was about whether two lovers will go their separate ways. I ran the chart today only to see from first glance that their two significators - Jupiter and Mercury- were approaching almost exact opposition ...however, Mercury- his ruler- just turned retrograde today at 14' Aries and instead of approaching Jupiter in opposition at 16 Libra, is now turning back and the exact opposition would not take place.
How would you interpred when the approaching aspect won`t take place due to a retrograde motion before becomimg exact?
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Sue



Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 945
Location: Australia

Posted: Sun Mar 20, 2005 10:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, that explains a lot. I have had terrible trouble with my computer today and have spent a great deal of time trying to deal with it. I joked to someone that anyone would think Mercury had turned retrograde the way it was carrying on. I didn't realise it had until I read this post. Smile

What was the time of the chart? Even if it was before Mercury turned retrograde, I am inclined to see that as a separating aspect although technically the chart will say it's applying. When a planet is this close to retrograding, it is stationary. The slower moving the planet, the longer it remains stationary. Mercury doesn't stay stationary for long but it would have been stationary for a few hours so it wasn't moving forward and was about to change direction. There is a lot of power in stationary planets. I see them as taking a moment to build up the energy to change direction to whichever way they have to go. They may have been heading towards each other but, if Mercury was stationary when the chart was drawn, this may have been the point where he paused and then made the decision to walk away before actually doing it. Jupiter is also retrograde at the moment. I don't know what time the chart was for or who asked the question but the Moon has recently been separating from a square to both significators.
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Taurus7



Joined: 23 Oct 2003
Posts: 580

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2005 9:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="Sue"]
Quote:
Even if it was before Mercury turned retrograde, I am inclined to see that as a separating aspect although technically the chart will say it's applying.

Hi,
Just seeking some clarification on your response...a few questions regarding this post:

1) As per the chart posted, the two planets were about to come to an opposition, so that would imply to me that the two lovers would go their separate ways. However, Mercury turned retrograde before the two could oppose each other. So would that imply that the two lovers would *not* go their separate ways?

2) Would Mercury going retrograde indicate that the person signified by Mercury was planning to go his/her separate way but changed his mind?

3) Eventually, Mercury will turn direct again and then it will actually oppose Jupiter. Does this mean that even though Mercury changed their mind and backed off, ultimately ehe/she will move direct again and break away?

4) The question was asked by a third party about two lovers (I think). So who would the Moon represent?

5) Although the two rulers were about to oppose each other, and one turned retrograde, there is still no positive aspect between the two or the Moon and the main rulers. Therefore, it would appear to me that the final answer would be that they will still go their separate ways - am I right?

Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to ask so many questions..... Confused
Would appreciate your response to as many as you have the time for (or none at all!!!)

Thanks.
Very Happy
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Sue



Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 945
Location: Australia

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2005 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unless I missed it, there has been no chart or information posted for this question. The only information we have is that Mercury and Jupiter are the significators. We don't know who asked the question or what time etc. It's a bit difficult to answer any of these questions without seeing the chart. I was assuming by Venera's post that Mercury had turned retrograde when the chart was calculated but it is only an assumption on my part.

Quote:
...the two planets were about to come to an opposition, so that would imply to me that the two lovers would go their separate ways.


Leaving aside the retrograde for the moment, an applying opposition does not necessarily mean separation. If they are applying and the aspect perfects, it is likely they will meet somehow. Given that it is an opposition, it is likely that this is not a pleasant meeting. They might try to resolve things but will be unable too. Or they might meet in the divorce courts for example. Lilly warns that if an opposition perfects, the querent may end up wishing it hadn't because it can cause more trouble than resolve. An example he gives is if it is a matter of money owing, the querent might recover the money but it will cost him more in court costs than he received. In a relationship chart it might mean that they come back together but end up making things a lot worse. If Mercury has just turned retrograde, then they are separating from each other and will not meet. It suggests to me that he possibly changed his mind and walked away. This is only speculation though as I haven't seen the chart.
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Taurus7



Joined: 23 Oct 2003
Posts: 580

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
It suggests to me that he possibly changed his mind and walked away. This is only speculation though as I haven't seen the chart.


OK, that's very informative, Sue. Thanks for your response. Maybe Venera can post the data for the chart.
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