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Valens Quarters of the Moon

 
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Lazarus



Joined: 10 Dec 2014
Posts: 88

Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2016 6:30 pm    Post subject: Valens Quarters of the Moon Reply with quote

I am wondering if anyone has anything to share regarding this time lord technique. I have recently decided to start looking into it as I am attracted to it for its simplicity and the fact that it is highly individualized (it is based on the unique structure of the natal chart). My feeling is that the planets, rather than their local determinations, should be emphasized, though it is hard to separate the two. Because it is based on the pre-natal lunation I am also wondering if it has to do more with the hidden dimensions of a person's life, perhaps their inner world and whatever is guiding them strongly from the past, but this is just a theory.
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zoidsoft



Joined: 10 Feb 2006
Posts: 944
Location: Pulaski, NY

Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2016 11:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The decennials, Balbillus procedure, and several others are also similarly customized based upon planetary order. Schmidt suggested over 10 years ago that methods based upon the Moon might be more telling in nocturnal charts whereas methods based upon the Sun (such as decennials) are more telling in diurnal charts. There's evidence in Valens to support this assumption (his statement that each chart tells us how to interpret itself and that some charts/places/lots, etc are more "chrematistikos" (telling) than others.

Schmidt said that some general time lord methods seem to be based upon a predomination argument and others are more topically specific. As such, he suggested that if the method based upon a predomination happens to fail that predomination test, theoretically another method should be used because as Valens would say it's a less telling method. However, once a method wins the predomination test, there's no stopping it from delineating on topics because each planet will be an oikodektor and make requests of it's participating lord.

I programmed these into windows software (Delphic Oracle) which was released in late August 2003, then sought Schmidt's help with interpretive principles about a year later.
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Lazarus



Joined: 10 Dec 2014
Posts: 88

Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That makes a lot of sense and I will start looking at charts to see which time lord systems make the most sense for that specific chart. I still think that this particular method may best be used in relationship to a certain aspect of the native's life but am still new to it so I may be wrong. I guess I am attracted to the simplicity of it because it does not appear to rely upon chrematistikos; it is what it is... I keep returning to firdaria as well and am always surprised at how accurate it tends to be even though it is probably the least individualized time lord system... What I have noticed in general is that some of these systems don't begin to really speak until they are refined using solar returns and profections etc... it's almost as though we could look at several timelord systems and see which ones show themes being repeated by solar return, profections, directions, transits and progressions or other time lord systems... charts keep speaking to me in this way but more research is needed of course...
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zoidsoft



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Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 11:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For years Bob said that the goal is to render the periods intelligible so that "you know what you're looking at". Knowing what you're looking at comes from what Plato called the realm of the intelligibles which is part of the realm of Nous (or divine mind). The way to make it so, is to focus on the Sameness instead of the Otherness between time lord periods. So ask yourself these common sense questions...

When comparing the current L2 Mars lunar quarter, is there any similar theme that was present in the previous L2 Mars lunar quarters? The same can be done with all other time lord systems, but I suggest starting with the topically specific time lord systems such as ZR Fortune (bodily issues, health and finances) or ZR Spirit (actions, reputation and focus of energy toward praxis). You might find that two periods are similar in time for a given issue, but it will be easier to see if you're focusing on a narrow range of manifestation such as "health" (ZR Fortune). If you stick with general time lord systems, then I suggest looking at the house placement to see what topic that represents and look at how that topic might have a result or disposition coming from sub period lords and their aspect relation or lack thereof. But if you're doing this, you're not necessarily looking at the Sameness between periods because it's likely that successive major period lords will not represent the same topics. Instead, the Sameness has to come from a predefined idea or "given" for what that topic is. In this case, you might try looking at if there was a change of theme topically when these general lords switch over. Often times it's not obvious what that might be.

In regards to the general time lord systems, I'm currently treating them as topically specific, but for the whole life in the sense that it might be more likely to highlight what's the most important issue going on in that person's life. I only use lunar quarters if the prenatal lunation has strong predomination influence or the Moon is strong by placement and sect.

I have the prenatal lunation near my IC and noticed something peculiar. On every L2 period when the Moon had the times with the lord (general period) was cadent, I had a change of residence. And back in late 2012 I went to L1 Moon period and I ended up residing shortly thereafter at the place I was born (which was the same period I was born with). So while I was born of the diurnal sect, I don't necessarily think that one has to discount testimony of other time lord systems entirely. It might simply be that the kind of testimony coming from such a method has lower rank and that such rank is a means for rendering the grander picture intelligible.
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Lazarus



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Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 5:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While the predomination approach makes a lot of sense, astrology continues to evade rationality to a certain extent. For example in one chart I am looking at the part of fortune resides in the 7th house in Leo conjunct Mars and in his terms. The Sun is in Aries and so also bears witness, yet via zodiacal releasing from fortuna I find myself rather unconvinced that it is an accurate timelord procedure for this chart. It certainly isn't convincing when I look at certain key events in her life concerning relationship and the death of her mother, however it may be more accurate with regard to health and general fortune, but I would need more details about those things in order to test the method. On the other hand the Moon is in Virgo and in the 8th separating from a conjunction with Saturn and thus far both the firdaria and the quarters method seem to show good results. The pre natal conjunction resides in Pisces in sextile aspect to an angular Venus but otherwise it does not witness the Asc being in the 2nd house/sign.
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zoidsoft



Joined: 10 Feb 2006
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Posted: Tue Jan 05, 2016 12:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lazarus wrote:
While the predomination approach makes a lot of sense, astrology continues to evade rationality to a certain extent. For example in one chart I am looking at the part of fortune resides in the 7th house in Leo conjunct Mars and in his terms. The Sun is in Aries and so also bears witness, yet via zodiacal releasing from fortuna I find myself rather unconvinced that it is an accurate timelord procedure for this chart...


It might not be, but first make sure that it's really fortune. According to Serapio, even if the chart is diurnal, if the Sun is in a feminine sign and in the west while the Moon is more in a rising condition (See John Denver's chart for example) then the lots might switch. (fortune and spirit) However a 7th house fortune also typically means a 7th house spirit unless a sign boundary intervenes.

We're not playing with a full deck of cards here so it's important not to make assumptions based upon a few days research. I'm still working on these now going 20+ years...
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Lazarus



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Posted: Tue Jan 05, 2016 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

At a glance releasing from Spirit seems to be showing things a bit better but I would need to go more in depth to really determine if this is the case. What I do notice is that the Moon very closely sextiles Spirit, while the Sun only witnesses Fortune and is itself cadent in the 3rd... The Moon also sits conjunct Saturn who rules the Aquarius Asc and is trined by Venus in Taurus... so in some ways the Moon is more influential and even powerful I would say, and thus releasing from Spirit therefore might make more sense...

Also a good reminder not to jump to conclusions too soon about these things. Thanks. I learned a lot today studying zodiacal releasing from Spirit using the chart of Sri Aurobindo. The results were quite mind blowing actually and I learned a few things about time lord systems in general as well and about major period vs minor period. I personally believe that profections are critical to refining those time lord systems that cover greater spans of time.
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