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The US Presidential election of 2016
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pankajdubey



Joined: 17 Nov 2006
Posts: 1218
Location: Delhi

Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2016 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

?? How can a newspaper agency calling the election be official time.Hillary's concession call could be more relevant as she was a contender who conceded even before all the results were out.
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unique_astrology



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 141

Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2016 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pankajdubey wrote:
?? How can a newspaper agency calling the election be official time.Hillary's concession call could be more relevant as she was a contender who conceded even before all the results were out.


Not looking for an argument. You are entitled to your opinion. I reported the information that was available. What time would be used if no concession speech was ever made?
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Aurelia



Joined: 30 Oct 2016
Posts: 16

Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2016 1:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pankajdubey wrote:
?? How can a newspaper agency calling the election be official time.Hillary's concession call could be more relevant as she was a contender who conceded even before all the results were out.


I'm looking for the time the demonstrations have started. Yes I think it's the newspaper agency calling the election what caused and started the uproar.
You think the HC concession speech was what started these protests?
If so what would be the chart for "demonstrations" then?
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waybread



Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 934
Location: Canada

Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The actual time when a presidential candidate wins is probably impossible to determine. It should be whenever the winning candidate earned 270 electoral ballots. News services that "call" an election outcome generally do this on the basis of projections. I remember that in 2000, CNN called the Florida election for Al Gore, then had to backtrack and call it a tie with George W. Bush. Without Florida, neither candidate had 270 electoral ballots. This tie hung up the entire election outcome for weeks, as some of you recall.

I doubt that news services call an election result at the same time, but the later ones are probably consistent with the first one.

I don't think the time of a concession speech is relevant. Nobody actually has to concede for the states to certify the results of their popular votes as these translate into ballots for the Electoral College.

I think the timing of the first state's Electoral College electors meeting is relevant. This really is the start of the national vote certification process.

While I don't expect the EC to overturn the results of the November 8 popular vote result, an event-based chart for this date (December 19) may say something about the nation and Trump presidency going forward.

I've not turned over every stone to find out what time the first state Electoral College/s meet/s, but maybe some of you on the East Coast could find this out for your state. In Massachusetts, the Electoral College apparently meets at 3:00 pm, according to state law. https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartI/TitleVIII/Chapter54/Section148
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Pat P.



Joined: 20 Nov 2016
Posts: 2
Location: Vashon, WA USA

Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The actual time when a presidential candidate wins is probably impossible to determine. It should be whenever the winning candidate earned 270 electoral ballots. News services that "call" an election outcome generally do this on the basis of projections. I remember that in 2000, CNN called the Florida election for Al Gore, then had to backtrack and call it a tie with George W. Bush. Without Florida, neither candidate had 270 electoral ballots. This tie hung up the entire election outcome for weeks, as some of you recall.

I doubt that news services call an election result at the same time, but the later ones are probably consistent with the first one.


Hi Waybread,

We do indeed have a time for when Trump surpassed the 270 electoral votes. The Associated Press reported it at 2:29 a.m. EST, Nov. 9, after he won Wisconsin. The dateline on the story is Washington, D.C. (link below)

The AP is a wire service, but unlike Reuters or Agence France-Press, it is a cooperative of newspapers and TV and radio stations. AP reporters often share office space with local newspapers, and the AP has bureaus in most state capitals. Ballots are processed at the county level, so having reporters on the ground means they get results fast. Here is the AP's FAQ on how it collects and reports election results:

http://www.ap.org/products-services/elections/FAQs

The menu on the upper left has a link to a page explaining how they call elections. Projections are made a local level, but the Washington, D.C., bureau makes the final decision. You're right about calling some of the primaries early. However, because the presidential race was so close, they didn't call it until Trump actually had the electoral votes needed to win.

http://elections.ap.org//content//latest-donald-trump-elected-president

Quote:
I don't think the time of a concession speech is relevant. Nobody actually has to concede for the states to certify the results of their popular votes as these translate into ballots for the Electoral College.

I think the timing of the first state's Electoral College electors meeting is relevant. This really is the start of the national vote certification process.

While I don't expect the EC to overturn the results of the November 8 popular vote result, an event-based chart for this date (December 19) may say something about the nation and Trump presidency going forward.

I've not turned over every stone to find out what time the first state Electoral College/s meet/s, but maybe some of you on the East Coast could find this out for your state. In Massachusetts, the Electoral College apparently meets at 3:00 pm, according to state law. https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartI/TitleVIII/Chapter54/Section148


I totally agree with you about the chart for the Electoral College. They meet at their state capitals, at different times, but I'd go with the earliest one, which appears to be 10 a.m. EST in Indianapolis, Indiana. I'm using Washington, D.C., as the location, but I imagine there are others who would argue for Indianapolis. There's an approximate 12-degree difference in the Ascendant, because Indianapolis is considerably farther west. If you use Indianapolis, the Ascendant is in late Capricorn, whereas the chart for Washington has Aquarius Rising.

I got this information from a website that's tracking the EC meeting times. They give their sources, so we can verify. Several states are missing from the list, but given that the EC isn't meeting that early in any other state, and since this is the Eastern-most time zone, it's probably a safe bet that it will end up being the earliest time. The site host says they will update the list as they get more info:

http://www.thegreenpapers.com/G16/EC-Meeting.phtml#NY

I hope this is helpful.
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Mark
Moderator


Joined: 30 Sep 2005
Posts: 4958
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland

Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pat.P wrote:
Quote:
I hope this is helpful.


Thanks Pat. And let me to take this opportunity to welcome you to the Skyscript forum and the mundane pages in particular.

Mark
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waybread



Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 934
Location: Canada

Posted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pat, this is great information, thanks.
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Pat P.



Joined: 20 Nov 2016
Posts: 2
Location: Vashon, WA USA

Posted: Tue Nov 22, 2016 8:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you, Mark. This is a good group, with a lot of collective knowledge. I would have registered before, but this is the first time I had anything useful to add to the discussion.
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ModWasp



Joined: 21 Mar 2014
Posts: 725
Location: England

Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

x

Last edited by ModWasp on Fri Dec 16, 2016 4:23 am; edited 1 time in total
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james_m



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
Posts: 2901
Location: vancouver island

Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ModWasp wrote:
Whoa! Hold on Nelly!

Is free speech not allowed here? I completely understand that astrologers are becoming more elitist and slightly more autocratic now we are in the AoA. But is that to say one cannot counter the brazenly socialist opinions set forth by the many of the socialist astrologers on this forum? Especially as we all know the socialism has failed in every single case?

x

Quote:
This forum is only for discussion of mundane astrology. Its not like some FB astrology groups where flaming or partisan politics seems to be the order of the day. And its not a soapbox to set out our political views either on the right or left. Stop it and stick to the astrology. This is not up for debate.


thanks for proving everything the moderator said in the quote above and highlighting why they said it!! delete this post when the nonsense is over.. thanks..
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