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Skyscript Astrology Forum

Hillary Clinton-Birth Certificate sourced?
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james_m



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
Posts: 2901
Location: vancouver island

Posted: Sat Oct 15, 2016 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for the article highlighting all the in's and out's to the marc penfield dance... kinda sad kettle of fish that is.. as i have said previously - we don't have a solid birth time for hillary, and thanks to toms quote from steven birchfield on the other thread - these 30 degree wedges can really throw you for a loop if the time is off by a few seconds sometimes!

aside from finding the quote on the rectification system liking the 220am time the most, i remain in the same position i was in before this pr stunt took place..

page 1 The US Presidential election of 2016
Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:30 pm
james_m wrote:

it seems such a shame that a public birth record isn't available for such an important public figure, but this is the state of ambivalence and/or outright hostility towards astrology that continues today..

i am conflicted over the use of a time for hillary.. i looked into this at length the last go around, but probably don't have the stomach for it this time round..
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Vicki



Joined: 14 Aug 2012
Posts: 183
Location: Nottingham U.K.

Posted: Sun Oct 16, 2016 9:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

" kinda sad kettle of fish that is.. "

Indeed !

Times have not changed much since the days of Vettius Valens :-

"they have revealed a thoroughly barbarian mind. One might say that they act like the Sirens, who attracted sailors with their treacherous, but harmonious voices and with the music of instruments and of baneful song, then destroyed them on the reefs of the deep. This is what some men suffer and have suffered, men who fall in with the sects of those "other astrologers" beguiled from the start by their spectacular words and their spells, they have become lost in a trackless wilderness ......... So then, saying farewell to these men, we will reach the glory which lies before us."

"Anthologies" Book 2
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elleiif3



Joined: 02 Aug 2015
Posts: 7
Location: Vero Beach, FL

Posted: Sun Oct 23, 2016 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While someone may or may not be "off", when one looks at all the various charts and HRC history the 2:08 or 2:18 fit better than any other chart, especially if you turn the charts for partners, home, etc.. Forget the personality differences and objectively look at all the options compared to history and factual knowledge regarding the Clintons, not illusions.

Astrologers that use times based on personal preferences and not facts will be mislead by their own hubris. What someone with any of these charts says is subject to trust or veiling issues. Look at WikiLeaks. Trust is an issue with this person no matter which chart you look at. Can anyone physically go and see the supposed birthchart?

**********
From the thread: @ skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9257&highlight
Mark Cullen
"However, I corresponded with Zayin Cohen a few weeks ago. Zayin Cohen then claimed the time he had actually found was 02.08am not 02.18am. He said it was incorrectly reported on ADB and elsewhere. However, with the death of Louis Rodden it never got resolved. Like Marc Penfield, Zayin Cohen claimed to have an anonymous source in the Chicago Public Records office. He has long said he cannot give out the certificate or details of the official as this is illegal.

But I have been in contact with Patrick Watson today and he showed me evidence of a FB conversation with Zayin Cohen back in August when he was informed by Zayin Cohen that the right time was actually 01.18am not 02.18am. I am trying not to throw out accusations here but Zayin Cohen is clearly giving out conflicting times. So was the time on the birth certificate always really 02.18am which has been corroborated by Marc Penfield? In which case why is Zayin Cohen now altering his time? Did Marc Penfield really source this directly or is he just using the time that was widely attributed to Zayin Cohen earlier which he now himself disputes? Or maybe Zayin Cohen is playing games with us and the time was always 02.18am. Presumably, like Zayin Cohen , Marc Penfield will not be able to produce a scan of the birth certificate for legal reasons."
**********

What does get retracted is the confirmation of the 2:18. This does not refute the 2:08 time. The 2:08 does have the possibility of being correct and the recorder of the data could have transposed the time to 8:02. Irregardless of whether it is 2:08 (more likely) or 2:18 the real Hillary R Clinton now being exposed by the WikiLeaks document releases fits the early a.m. charts rather nicely. Objectivity is key.
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waybread



Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 934
Location: Canada

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

States that do not reveal birth certificates to the public do so for privacy reasons. Sometimes we just have to accept people's right to privacy.
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james_m



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
Posts: 2901
Location: vancouver island

Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 12:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

waybread wrote:
Sometimes we just have to accept people's right to privacy.


lol.. tell that to google, nsa, gchq and all the other information collection agencies that have a lock hold on the internet... they see antiquated concepts of privacy as the joke that it is circa 2016..privacy means about as much as the words freedom and democracy these days- all words that i am quite sure pour out of the main political contenders mouths, while there actions tell an entirely different story.. got to catch the next terrorist ya know.. words have lost so much of their meaning these days..
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waybread



Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 934
Location: Canada

Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 3:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

James, I'm not keen on "two wrongs make a right" debate tactics. Right now in the US the fact that most states' birth data are confidential encourages people to use birth certificate info like their mother's birth surname (quaintly called "maiden name") for bank and pension passwords. We have a big problem with identity theft. Sometimes we just have to accept that astrologers have no particular right to people's birth data, as much as we might wish to have it.
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james_m



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
Posts: 2901
Location: vancouver island

Posted: Sat Oct 29, 2016 9:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

waybread wrote:
James, I'm not keen on "two wrongs make a right" debate tactics.


neither am i, but i don't think a person can come out talking about the importance of privacy without also observing how the governments of the world at this time don't give a rats ass about privacy, or only in so far as it serves their interests, which at this point are the corporations interests..

now, back to the topic.

i think people wanting to run for the highest office in the usa need to be held to a different standard.. should their health records be made publicly available? yes, i think they ought to be.. perhaps you'd like to argue that is private too?

do they have to share their birth time? we live in a world where astrology has and continues to be beaten down by the naysayers more then not.. if astrological data is of no importance to 99% of the population, excepting astrologers, should this info be made available for the astrological community and what infringement on their privacy is a birth time? maybe we can have people who don't have to reveal their names either... anonymous 1 is running for the highest office in the usa.. their name is confidential... maybe this is a poor analogy, but you can get the drift with a bit of imagination..

those running for the highest office need to be held to a different standard.. revealing the birth time is not an invasion of privacy, but laws are laws and lawyers make asses of themselves regularly arguing for this or that and convincing the politicians to embody their agenda - which i repeat is the corporate agenda circa 2016 on most of the planet.. what do you have to say about birth times being publicly available in countries like scotland? is that an invasion of privacy too, but legalized, so it is okay? i am curious. is your position to side with whatever the lawyers write into law? i get that on a superficial level..
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SGFoxe



Joined: 13 Apr 2006
Posts: 258
Location: Chicago, IL

Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2016 2:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i don't see how a 2 am chart fits in with her life at all ... she is SO 12th house ... I use 7:30 ish but I like the 8:02 am because it puts mercury in the 12th ... the communicator in the house of secrets and self undoing ... my friend, a hillary correlate eg scorp 1947 isn't voting ... and her husband Bill's sun in the ninth close to the 10th cusp with his taurus sun in her 7th ... her 22 pisces moon conjunct her daughter's mercury (which i've just clarified to myself, it is not Cheslea's sun at 22 but her mercury, her sun at 6 pisces) e'en so, I am so despondent ... the cubs are at the top of the 7th and losing big time ...

Hillary was born in north Wrigleyville Chicago ... she should be at the game tomorrow night and would be if she had the moxie ... everybody's making plans about November 9th ... well mars slips into aquarius and is in a volatile awfully dangerous mars/uranus mutual reception ... the anniversary of Kristallnacht nicht wahr? Lots of angry people with guns ... I think of the Clintons as the Bobby Joe and Billy Sue who took the money and ran, and the whole idea of the Clinton Foundation just reeks ... but still, given hobson's choice donald's loans of 100s of millions of dollars from chinese, russian & deutschbank ... fertile grounds for treason ... Madeleine Albright called him Putin's biyoch ... the Clinton Foundation(s) the lesser of the evils
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