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Receptions and conflicting testimonies
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felipeastrologo



Joined: 02 Apr 2015
Posts: 225

Posted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polina wrote:
Also he seems to react more to emotions but his Modus Operandi for any request is: 1) say no. 2) take a long time (months) to think about it 3) suggest we do exactly what I asked, as if it were his idea. I'm not saying that will be the case here, but if he says "no" now, I'm hoping for it.
It is also odd and maybe doesnt relate to his own natal that he is a Water Sun (Pisces) so I would really expect emotion to touch him a lot more than this chart implies it does.


The chart does not imply that he does not react to emotions. He does react alright! I said he does not like it.

The suggestion to speak to his mind or minimize over-emotional expression is to bypass that obstacle of his rejection of your emotions.

Polina wrote:
In other words, if anything, I would expect him to react to my emotions and not a logical argument.


He reacts to both, like all humans. He has a degree of rejection/resistance to your emotions, which is widely know to the study of psychology. If we give people what they don't like the result is obvious. But you cannot and should not simply turn off your emotions, so ideally he has to learn to accept them, take them into consideration, and all that that implies.

Polina wrote:
Also - when will the Sun leave the 12th? Can timing this give us an answer or is it only symbolic?


The Sun it is in a fixed sign so it won't be easy or quick. That is the message for now. No timing, as far as I am concerned. You may count the degrees to the end of Scorpio and apply a timing technique of your choice if you like. Personally, I would not do that because it may cause anxiety rather than help. But that's me.[/quote]

Polina wrote:
Because as I stated last year, when the apartment sells is when he is free and THAT is when things will move.


True freedom is freedom from fear. That needs to be worked on in addition to trying to sell the apartment. Fear finds reasons to say "no". It's its specialty.

Maybe selling the apartment is the game changer. We can hope it will be. But the Sun in the 12th is about more than that. It is about a limiting, often fearful, state of mind.
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Polina



Joined: 19 Sep 2014
Posts: 109

Posted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks again Felipe. Ok I wont do timing in this one then.

One question about significators, as I keep thinking about this:
If ASC + 5H are not ruled by Jupiter, and L1/L5 do not aspect each other in a chart, then can Jupiter aspecting L1 or Jup aspecting Venus give a "yes" for a future child? Or if the main signifs do not aspect, then it's automatically a "no"?

This struck a chord with me:
Quote:
True freedom is freedom from fear. That needs to be worked on in addition to trying to sell the apartment. Fear finds reasons to say "no". It's its specialty.

Maybe selling the apartment is the game changer. We can hope it will be. But the Sun in the 12th is about more than that. It is about a limiting, often fearful, state of mind.


I'm going to talk to him this week of course, matter-of-factly. I'm creating a list of what his possible fears could be, so I can try to assuage them. (so far: loss of finances & loss of freedom, neither of which will be a reality here for him). It may or may not work to assuage his fears but i'll try. He tends to process things glacially slowly, I hope he WILL process them over time. I can try, that's all I can do. And I've forme ad backup plan anyway because if I can't count on him, I need to move forward anyway.
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felipeastrologo



Joined: 02 Apr 2015
Posts: 225

Posted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polina wrote:
One question about significators, as I keep thinking about this:
If ASC + 5H are not ruled by Jupiter, and L1/L5 do not aspect each other in a chart, then can Jupiter aspecting L1 or Jup aspecting Venus give a "yes" for a future child? Or if the main signifs do not aspect, then it's automatically a "no"?


The way I approach horary, house rulers always take precedence over natural rulers. So I would want to see an L1-L5 aspect or a Moon-L5 aspect with supporting receptions and no major afflictions. And, of course, measure all testimonies against the forces at play in the context. I have never seen a chart about this with a Venus aspect, so I stick to the main significator (L1) and the main co-sig (Moon).

Polina wrote:
It may or may not work to assuage his fears but i'll try. He tends to process things glacially slowly, I hope he WILL process them over time. I can try, that's all I can do. And I've forme ad backup plan anyway because if I can't count on him, I need to move forward anyway.


Sounds like a good plan.

Best wishes,
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Polina



Joined: 19 Sep 2014
Posts: 109

Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
house rulers always take precedence over natural rulers. So I would want to see an L1-L5 aspect or a Moon-L5 aspect with supporting receptions and no major afflictions. And, of course, measure all testimonies against the forces at play in the context. I have never seen a chart about this with a Venus aspect, so I stick to the main significator (L1) and the main co-sig (Moon).

Thanks - this is a new part of the "Rules" for me, so it's super helpful to have it in black and white per se.

I spilled the beans to my boyfriend and said my matter-of-fact speeches last night. I was so nervous, i was shaking. But I told him how important this is to me, that I'm willing to carry 100% of the financial burden for the child and that if he doesn't participate I have to go forward for myself in any case. As our only option is IVF, that means i would have to buy donor materials. I dont want him to feel pressured so I said I have this option, but at the same time, in his shoes, I would not imagine wanting to continue living with me (his girlfriend) if I had a child by a donor, and that I'd understand that. He started asking questions about the process and said he's thinking about it. He had a lot of pessimistic replies "where will they go to school/all the schools here are horrible" "how will they get a job/the economy is bad". I said you and 20 million other people grew up here, graduated and found jobs, and this child will be no different... I said you're worried about things that are not problems, or not problems yet, plus I will handle it. You just need to know if you want to participate or not, knowing i've removed the financial burden and that this isnt some attempt to sit on your shoulders and pull money frmo your pockets. The ball as they say is in his court.

I ran a chart right after the talk to see if my attempts to persaude him would help in his decision to help me -- ie WILL he help me and participate in this attempt to have a child together or not? The chart is below. I presume it is not good news with all our significators in my 6th house (his 12th). But I'm not sure what to make of it -- he, me and the potential child are all ill/diseased? He is hiding from something?? I always have trouble with the 6th and 12th interpretations. Some say 6th is disease and that would mean this is not good for any of the 3 parties... The only good thing i see is we're all in the same sign/same house and there are aspects between child and him and me and child.
But each party (except for me - in Term of Jupiter) is in its own Term. But the Uranus aspect (Moon touches merc, then Merc touches Uranus, then Merc reaches him/Saturn) --does this mean loss?? does it stop the process of the aspects or does it not count as a modern planet? what is it saying?

Sun totally peregrine near end of sign - he cant act as a "man" (?) plus in his 12th...ehhh Confused
Coruler for him Pluto sextiles Venus but probably doesn't count for much?

I ask because there is a huge expense involved if i pay to ship donor materials and he changes his mind. I need to make the purchase this week so would like to know whether I should buy or not... Anyway I'm interested in any input on this 6th house saga going on...



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Polina



Joined: 19 Sep 2014
Posts: 109

Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2017 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just wanted to update the thread, as I'm in ecstatic shock: He agreed to try for a child with me?!?!?!!!! I cant believe it.
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Breeze



Joined: 16 Oct 2016
Posts: 221

Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2017 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Such a wonderful news !

Wishing you the bestttt !
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Polina



Joined: 19 Sep 2014
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Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2017 9:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks so much!! I'm in shock. I am waiting for the other shoe to drop...!
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