2
In his Introduction to Persian Nativities IV: Abu Ma'shar, On the Revolutions of the Years of Nativities (The Cazimi Press, 2019) Benjamin N. Dykes writes:
In Ch. 1.4, 29 [Abu Ma'shar] shows familiarity with three famous zijes: The Sindhind, Ptolemy's Almagest, and the Sasanian Persian Shahriydr (also known as the Zij al-Shah), suggesting that even in the mid to late 800s there were still astrologers using sidereal zodiacs on a regular basis.

Chapter 1.4, 23-31 offers other insights into astrological practices of his day, and the fact that even Abu Ma'shar mixed and matched sidereal and tropical values for different purposes. (p. 5)
http://www.snowcrest.net/sunrise/LostZodiac.htm

3
Thanks very much, I understood use of sidereal continued until the Arabic period, though I hadn't read Ben Dykes' work. I'm more curious about the Renaissance and later - the example of Junctinus proves the SZ didn't disappear altogether. And what about British astrologers in the Raj/East India Company days? BV Raman said in his autobiography that Alan Leo paid only lip service to Indian astrology, but Leo's generation would presumably have absorbed the SZ along with their Theosophy?

4
I haven't studied Renaissance astrology and later in any depth, but it seems that after Abu Ma'shar's time the sidereal zodiac disappeared in the west. Al Biruni (973-1049 CE) seems to have no knowledge of a fixed zodiac because in Al Beruni's India he criticizes the Indians for their lack of knowledge of the moving fixed stars:
This passage shows that Varahamihira had no knowledge of the motion of the fixed stars toward the east. He considers them, in agreement with the name, as fixed, immovable stars, and represents the solstices moving toward the west. In consequence of this fancy, he has, in the matter of the lunar stations, confounded two things... (p. 493)

The solstice has kept its place, but the constellations have migrated, just the very opposite of what Varahamihira has said. (p. 494)

Dr. Edward C. Sachau trans., Al Biruni's India, New Delhi: Rupa Publications Pvt. Ltd., 2002-2016.
From what I've read over the years, there was a complete zodiac divide between east and west after the Arabic period in the 800s until Cyril Fagan rediscovered the early sidereal zodiac in his research.

Even Rudolf Steiner (at one time a Theosophist) didn't understand the measurement of sidereal signs, but had to approximate the position of the constellations in his work.

Perhaps someone else reading this thread can offer more information on the zodiac in the west from the Renaissance on.
Last edited by Therese Hamilton on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:53 pm, edited 3 times in total.
http://www.snowcrest.net/sunrise/LostZodiac.htm

5
Thanks very much Therese, that passage doesn't appear in my abridged edition of Alberuni's India! Some irony that he's lecturing Varahamihira for treating the stars as fixed and the solstices as moving...

It appears Cyril Fagan's 20th C. sidereal movement was a genuine revival without any immediate Western precedent.

8
Astroart wrote:
Roger of Hereford (XII Cent.) was one of the first astrologers in the West who describes and promotes the sidereal zodiac in his book Liber de arte astronomice iudicandi. See Nicholas Whyte's dissertation in History and Philosophy of Science on this topic (Cambridge, 1991).

Yes, thank you! Here is the link to Roger's dissertation:
http://nicholaswhyte.info/roger.htm

It can be read by clicking on Rich Text format.
http://www.snowcrest.net/sunrise/LostZodiac.htm

9
For what it is worth: I use the system of Abu Mashar in tropical (what about in sidereal?): The distribution with lords of the terms, ninths and their decanates are a blessing for the astrologer … Sorry it's automatic translations from French, I didn't care much…
Regards,
François CARRIÈRE