The nature of the bounds in Horary

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We know that the cardinal signs initiate change; the fixed signs incline towards stability, but the mutable signs offer a flexible qualitiy that can adapt to requirements and eternal pressures - they are mutable in their nature.
(Skyscript Glossary of Terms)


The nature of the bounds

"It is also necessary to observe the bounds of the signs, that is to say the planets which are lords of the bounds and to associate them in the formulation of the judgments. Take, for example, the following case: we see the tropical signs (Aries, Cancer) and we say that there will be a change; but in Saturn's bounds it will turn out slowly, in Jupiter's or Mercury's bounds soon after, in Mars' bounds suddenly and unexpectedly, in Venus' bounds with some discouragement. And if the lords are in solid signs (Earth) or they are stationary, it can only mean slowness, but if they are not stationary, if they are in tropical signs (Aries, Cancer) they will mean swiftness."
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Yves Lenoble
http://www.yveslenoble.com/2014/06/20/c ... nes-fixes/
Blessings!

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Thanks, Ouranos. Some people think that the bound lords influence the planets in a major way. I personally am skeptical and I haven't tested this out. Where do you (and other Skyscripters) stand on this?

Also, "in Venus' bounds with some discouragement." Does the author provide a reason? This is puzzling, because Venus is a benefic?

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Thank you Amelia,

The extract is from
18 Giuliano di Laodicea, CCAG V/1, page. 187-188.

My own interpretation "with some discouragement" suggests more something like 'with ease or laziness, not pushing forward like Mars would do or trying to reach an agreement" if that makes sense. And I may be wrong.

What I get from his article is of course the Sign and its qualities would stand first but looking at the ruler of the sign and the bounds associated would help better qualify the matter.
I think it is part of the reception. If your ruler is in the bound of the ruler of the 7th, we have something here and looking at the planet ruling both dig a little more into the question.

And let's bring in Morin de Villefranche in Book XXI of Astrologia Gallica to better understand

zodiacal state = Sign and terrestrial state = House

Rule 20. When a planet is outside of its own sign, it provokes on thing because of its position in the house it occupies, and another because of its rulership in another house.
23. Each zodiacal sign always operates according to the nature and zodiacal state of its ruler, but not always according to the latter's local determination.
24. Each planet always acts according to the nature and zodiacal state of its dispositor. Most often it acts also by reason of the latter's terrestrial state. Finally, to a certain extent it acts also depending on its "Second Ruler".
52. When a planet is in unfavorable zodiacal or terrestrial state but its dispositor is in a favorable state, the affairs signified by the former will go badly in the beginning, but later will take a turn for the better, above all if the first planet approaches a good aspect from its dispositor. On the other hand, if the planet is in favorable zodiacal state, but its dispositor is in an unfavorable one, the success or happiness at the beginning will change into misfortune.

I could quote the whole Book but better if you have a look yourself
https://www.forumonastrology.com/foa/newmain.html
112 Rules for Delineation on the left

Best to you,
Ouranos
Blessings!

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Thanks for the info. Aha, this makes a lot of sense!-
Ouranos wrote:My own interpretation "with some discouragement" suggests more something like 'with ease or laziness, not pushing forward like Mars would do or trying to reach an agreement" if that makes sense. And I may be wrong.
I have a chart that substantiates this:
When a planet is in unfavorable zodiacal or terrestrial state but its dispositor is in a favorable state, the affairs signified by the former will go badly in the beginning, but later will take a turn for the better, above all if the first planet approaches a good aspect from its dispositor. On the other hand, if the planet is in favorable zodiacal state, but its dispositor is in an unfavorable one, the success or happiness at the beginning will change into misfortune.
(The part in bold type, I observe, is in line with Bonatti's teaching.)

My chart is about whether a creative project would succeed.

Jupiter the ascendant lord is in a very bad state but applies favourably to her dispositor, a strong Saturn, in his house of joy. It took the querent lots of effort, and there had been delays. The project found some level of success half a year later.

The Moon also testifies to a possible success with labour and persistence. She is square Mercury, which is in the 9th sign from the ascendant (9th as publishing/higher learning). The Moon is received by Dorothean term + triplicity.
Image

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Thank you for sharing Amelia,

I also note the ruler of Mercury, Mars in Aries (rulership) partile trine to the MC of success. Mercury in his own bound and Mars in the bound of Mercury.

Cheers!
Ouranos
Blessings!

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Ouranos wrote:I also note the ruler of Mercury, Mars in Aries (rulership) partile trine to the MC of success. Mercury in his own bound and Mars in the bound of Mercury.
Très bonne observation, Ouranos. The Mars is even in the ascendant (and therefore could co-represent the querent/matter)!