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Skyscript Astrology Forum

Void Moons
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Zosma



Joined: 11 Nov 2018
Posts: 212

Posted: Fri Feb 26, 2021 9:56 pm    Post subject: Void Moons Reply with quote

As someone who has a Void, of course, Moon in the natal chart,& having observed Void moons in several natal charts it seems to me that they can be difficult for the nativity, as well as being negative in the horary & electional charts, as in J Bidens inauguration chart, Could this mean his election will be Voided & come to nothing?
I am aware that there are several interpretations of the condition of Void moons from Hellenistic to modern times but for me, the modern interpretation of no aspect formed until after the moon leaves its current sign seems right.
Winston Churchill had a Void moon & he suffered from the "black dog of depression" & went through his wilderness years. I find the Void moon in natal charts can point to a remoteness with the mother in some way either physically or emotionally. Has anybody noticed the effects of Void moons in nativities?
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
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Posted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What constitutes a "feral" body is up for debate in the first place. If the body aspects another planet out of sign I personally do not regard it as VOC, for example. Also, if it is separating from a body, that body might hold its light and have a lot of control over what that body does perhaps.

The way I view it is that a planet that is truly feral may be weakened in some way and the luminaries are supposed to represent things like physical and mental health, life force, longevity versus a shortened life, weak health or mental illnesses, etc. I have an unaspected (traditionally anyway) Sun conjunct Algol with a diurnal natal chart, making it more significant, and I would have died at the age of 5 of pneumonia if it were not for modern medicine, as an example. I was a very sickly child in general. I do have Mercury in the same sign but it is too far away for an orb.

The Moon in horary is more significant because horary is an area that looks at things that happen in a short term, relatively speaking, although some people say it can predict longterm things too. The Moon is the swiftest body and so it shows changes. It is also important in event charts for the same reason. I haven't looked at Biden's inauguration chart to comment on the condition of the Moon, but some would say if the Moon is in a specific sign (signs where the Moon is strong or signs of Jupiter, the greater benefic), that will help. If it helps in horary I would guess it would in event charts too.

https://www.skyscript.co.uk/gl/feral.html
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james_m



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
Posts: 3984
Location: vancouver island

Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2021 1:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

there are some good comments worth reading on voc moon here on skyscript, but the search feature of the forum has to be engaged...

here is one thread worth checking out -

https://skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7399&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

chris brennan wrote a good summary article on this that he shares on this thread as well - and which i am sharing again here -

http://theastrologydictionary.com/v/void-of-course/

cheers james
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Therese Hamilton



Joined: 22 Feb 2011
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Location: California, USA

Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2021 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

James, thanks for the reminder of Chris Brennan's article and his Dictionary web site. This site has been on-line since 2012, but this is the first time I've known about it. Chris' definitions and articles on the site are tops, a great resource for everyone. He really has the last word on Void of Course as he gives definitions for the three historical meanings.
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Ouranos



Joined: 28 Mar 2020
Posts: 570

Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2021 6:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We define a Void Moon (or planet) by its position in a sign and the major aspects it makes to other planets. It seems more important in Horary because of the Time structure inherent in a question.
In a natal chart, I look at it differently.
As it relates to numbers, we look at the conjunction(1), opposition(2), trine(3), square(4), sextile(6). What about the quintile(5), septile(7), semi-square and sesqui-square (8th), novile(9) and even the semi-sextile or quincunx(12)? They will tell a story and they may even be part of a planetary configuration.
A Void planet can indicate aloneness (the presence of oneself) as opposed to loneliness (the absence of other).
Meaning that the planet is not selfish by itself but it brings Aha! moments when it interacts with the world. It doesn't need others to function and like a cat they always fall back on their paws.
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Zosma



Joined: 11 Nov 2018
Posts: 212

Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2021 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all the links & comments Tanit James Therese & Ouranos . I did write a detailed reply earlier but it mysteriously vanished, looking at the moon phase it was a void of course moon when it vanished so I waited 43 minutes for the moon to enter Scorpio to send this reply. It seems even the Cosmos is hinting to respect the VOC moon. As regards Bidens VOC moon inauguration chart I will keep an eye on transits & lunation cycles touching the late degrees of Aries & note what if anything occurs.
Just to mention the last podcast of The astrology podcast with Chris Brennan goes into this subject in detail.
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Therese Hamilton



Joined: 22 Feb 2011
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Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2021 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zosma, thanks for reminding us of the Chris Brennan podcast! Can you please give us a direct link to the podcast?

Quote:
As regards Bidens VOC moon inauguration chart I will keep an eye on transits & lunation cycles touching the late degrees of Aries & note what if anything occurs.

The 2021 inaugural chart is a good example of why we can't continue to ignore the zodiac question. The Moon in the sidereal chart is very far from void as it applies to several planets including the rising Mars and Uranus. Various astrologers predicted dire events at the inauguration due to this conjunction, but it apparently pointed to the extreme security measures taken due to the invasion of the Capital by Trump supporters on January 6.

The inauguration itself felt peaceful and even spiritual as the closest aspect to the ascendant was Venus in the 9th from Sagittarius in its own mansion. Mercury and Neptune also aspect the ascendant. The inaugural navamsa is striking in that the ascendant and Venus are sitting on the Sun and Mercury in Kamala Harris' natal chart. Could we have predicted the outcome of the election from this navamsa (9th harmonic) chart?


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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
Posts: 1181

Posted: Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Moon is exalted in the left chart, and it might be argued it could then function just as it can in horary. Anyway, I would regard the Moon-Mars sextile on the left as within orb as well as the conjunction on the right. The traditional orb between them is about 10 degrees or less (12 plus 8 divided by 2):
https://www.skyscript.co.uk/aspectorbs.html

Is noon the correct time for the event? I honestly haven't cared enough to look into it. Also, if this is a question of Biden's inauguration it might be better to move this to the mundane forum.
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james_m



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
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Location: vancouver island

Posted: Thu Mar 04, 2021 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tanit,

unfortunately thereses post is about a topic that she is relentless on.... ''which is the true zodiac?" or something to that effect... a better idea would be for therese to start her own thread on this topic and make posts to herself with the occasional unsuspecting person wandering in to add comment to it! kid you not!

cheers
james
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Therese Hamilton



Joined: 22 Feb 2011
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Location: California, USA

Posted: Thu Mar 04, 2021 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tanit3333 wrote:

Quote:
The Moon is exalted in the left chart, and it might be argued it could then function just as it can in horary. Anyway, I would regard the Moon-Mars sextile on the left as within orb as well as the conjunction on the right. The traditional orb between them is about 10 degrees or less (12 plus 8 divided by 2):
https://www.skyscript.co.uk/aspectorbs.html

Is noon the correct time for the event? I honestly haven't cared enough to look into it. Also, if this is a question of Biden's inauguration it might be better to move this to the mundane forum.

Generally in harmonic charts (left navamsa chart) the emphasis is on planets in sign only. Traditionally in India degrees aren't noted in varga (harmonic) charts, so aspects aren't read in those charts. But western programs calculate degrees in these charts. I'm sorry, I shouldn't have gone off track by posting the navamsa chart. My point was that there are differences in Void Moons between zodiacs.

I think when astrologers cast horary charts for themselves or clients, the planets 'tune into' the astrologer's chosen zodiac to give correct answers. But event charts are different, and two opposing Moons (void and not void) can't both be correct. Maybe void Moons are only effective in horary charts? That might be the real question?

Yes, the Inaugural is always at 12 Noon on January 20 when the office of the new president takes effect.
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Zosma



Joined: 11 Nov 2018
Posts: 212

Posted: Thu Mar 04, 2021 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is the link Therese https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZ4WQExbelI The sidereal/Tropical VOC moon dilemma is interesting the tropical works for me but eveything is relative in this multiverse,truth maybe in relation to perception & as I have been shown our perception can be altered by others.
It will be interesting to see what occurs when the moon progresses onto the mars/Uranus conjunction should the moon be void sleepy will fall out of bed.
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Therese Hamilton



Joined: 22 Feb 2011
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Location: California, USA

Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 2:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zosma, thanks for the link to Chris Brennan's podcast. He has so many podcasts that it can be difficult to find the one we want. Yes, it will be interesting to see the events when the Moon progresses to Mars/Uranus. I hope you or someone else will write a post when this happens. (I don't use progressions myself.)

Now to see what Chris Brennan has to say about Void Moons!
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Zosma



Joined: 11 Nov 2018
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Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Take a look at ‘the Duran Biden forgets what the Pentagon is called & who is his Secretary of Defense ‘on you tube as this is suppressed in MSM. And it becomes apparent what the progressed void moon on to Mars Uranus will look like. A war will be orchestrated to deflect what is happening to Biden.
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Zosma



Joined: 11 Nov 2018
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Posted: Tue Mar 09, 2021 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the link in question https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeMTsJSAOiY
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Therese Hamilton



Joined: 22 Feb 2011
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Posted: Wed Mar 10, 2021 12:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zosma wrote:
Quote:
Take a look at ‘the Duran Biden forgets what the Pentagon is called & who is his Secretary of Defense ‘on you tube as this is suppressed in MSM. And it becomes apparent what the progressed void moon on to Mars Uranus will look like. A war will be orchestrated to deflect what is happening to Biden.

I can well imagine that Biden has memory problems. He's only two years younger than I am, and some days I'm lucky if I can remember my own name! And to even try to run a country!? But as for the bad effects of the Moon on Mars-Uranus, wouldn't that be the opposite of a void Moon which is supposed to bring zero results? (I'll try to watch the link you posted later this evening.)

Notes on what Charles Carter says (The Astrological Aspects) about a Mars-Uranus conjunction:

Will power, courage, dogged persistence

Little patience under stress and strain

Such great nervous strain that the native can break under it

At any rate the inaugural chart is the chart of an event, and we really have to look at Biden's chart to see what is going on with him personally. I haven't tracked inaugural charts in the past for the four year periods of a presidential office, but it seems that the chart should reflect events for the country in general.
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