Joined: 28 Mar 2020
|Posted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 10:53 am Post subject: Of Parents - Daniele Jay
[by Danièle Jay]
L'Echo d'Hermes no 31 - 2016
Danièle Jay, is a French astrologer, specialist in ancient astrology and in particular the work of Ptolemy. She actively participated in the working group initiated by Giuseppe Bezza [1946-2014], who died too soon. She published an excellent book 'Pour une Astrologie de l'Evénement' on Traditional Astrology. She wrote this article in L'Echo d'Hermes no. 31 – 2016]
Note : This is a free translation.
After having briefly exposed, in Book I of the Tetrabiblos, the most essentials of astrological doctrine, then to have devoted himself, in Book II, to the study of
World astrology in its most often meteorological aspect, Ptolemy addresses in Book III the examination of individual themes, starting, in the natural order of things, with what preceded births, namely parents. This study is the subject of an entire chapter [III, 4].
Our author's interest is focused on three fundamental points:
1] What are the significators of the parents?
2] What will be their condition of existence?
3] What will their lifespan be?
Ptolemy will endeavor to answer these three questions.
1] Parents: their signifiers
Logically, and in accordance with his nature, the father has two male stars as significators, the Sun in a diurnal chart, Saturn in a nocturnal chart. The mother two female stars, Venus in the diurnal chart, the Moon in the nocturnal chart. From the quality, position and configuration of these significators, either among themselves or with the other planets, will be determined what concerns the parents themselves. Ptolemy, always concise, does not say more, thus leaving the reader to apply the rules which were developed in Book I of the Tetrabiblos.
Vettius Valens, Rhetorius, among others, will give parents the same significators as those of Ptolemy. However, these authors will be more verbose than the prince of astrologers. They will recall that the parents' character is drawn from the stars configured to the Luminaries.
Saturn configured to the Sun, for example, will give the father a severe side; he will be resentful, miserly, secretive, suffering.
Jupiter will make him generous, free, happy;
Mars, daring, angry, ardent, insulting, insolent, even drunk;
Venus, affectionate, music lover, pious;
Mercury, expert in communication and science, but from time to time a liar.
The Sun in a masculine sign, aspected by a masculine star, will produce an honest and talented father. In a feminine sign, observed by the Moon or by Venus, an effeminate and unrestrained father.
The Moon in a feminine sign, aspected by a feminine star, will grant a submissive, gentle, benevolent mother. In a masculine sign, aspected by a masculine star, an angry and indomitable mother [Vettius Valens, Anthologies, II, 33].
Parents will get along wonderfully if the ruler of the Sun is well configured to the Moon and the ruler of the Moon is well configured to the Sun. On the other hand, the parents will separate if an evil star intervenes between the two Luminaries; or if a malefic unites with one of the two Luminaries, the latter not respecting his Haïresis  or Sect Ruler; or if Saturn is with the Sun, while the Moon separates from them [Anthologies, II, 34].
Rhetorius, Valens, will not stick to the traditional significators, Sun and Saturn for the father, Venus and Moon for the mother: they will endeavor to study their Parts: Part of the Father , Part of the Mother [3 ], which should be consulted in all cases. The Part of the Father occupying a place unrelated to the Ascendant will indicate a humble and modest father [the part could for example occupy the II, the VI, the VIII, the XII].
If the Lord of the Part is conjunct to the Part, the father will be omnipresent and will bring harmony to the family.
If the Lord of the Part is in opposition to the Part, the father will be absent or will abandon thé children.
If the Lord of the sign opposite to the sign of the Part is found conjunct the Part, there will be adoption.
Rhetorius will recommend, furthermore, to carefully examine the Triplicity Rulers of the significators, as well as their Rulers by Term, as we will see it later. Without forgetting the Rulers of the Parts of thé father or the mother, their place by house, their phase in relation to the Sun, the configurations they receive, because they will all give precious indications about the parents.
When the Sun and the Moon are in tropical signs, if ASC is also there, and especially if the evil ones aspect them, the parents will be strangers or belong to another ethnic group. Also when the Luminaires are completely unrelated. The Sun in the 7th House, while the Moon is in its Full Moon phase, will cause the parents to separate.
According to Rhetorius, the New or the Full Moon means the mother, while their Rulers means the father [Astrological Compendium] 
2] Parents: their means of subsistence
To study the fortune and wealth of parents, Ptolemy uses a very interesting notion, taken up by many ancient astrologers, completely forgotten today, that of the doruphoros [Doryphory], the portelance, or spearbearer of which he still speaks in Book IV, chapter 3. This Greek term designates, according to Rhetorius, an "armed guard forming part of the following a prince ". The wealth and heritage of the parents "are judged by the guards who surround the Luminaries" [Nicolas Bourdin].
To be "guards" ["waiters", Robbins will say], the planets which escort the Sun [the king] must be matutines , must belong to the same faction as him, and be in the same zodiacal sign or in the following sign. In his fascinating Parisian seminar of November 29, 2008, Giuseppe Bezza had specified that the 'spearbearer' must also have a rulership over the Sun. The planets which escort the Moon [the queen] must, on the other hand, be vespertines , belong to the same faction as her and be in the same zodiacal sign or in the following sign.
Thus, the Sun is preceded, the Moon precedes. When these 'spearbearers' are beneficial planets, they announce an “illustrious and dazzling” fortune for the parents, the luminaries being moreover favorably placed.
If the planets Saturn and Venus are Eastern, in their face , or Angulars, they signify prosperity for each of the parents. If, on the other hand, the Luminaries are Void of Course and are not accompanied by any procession or 'spearbearers', the parents will suffer poverty and live in thé shadow, especially with Venus and Saturn misplaced in the chart. If the Luminaries are surrounded by planets which are of an opposing faction, such as for example Mars in procession to the Sun, or Saturn to the Moon, or if they are beneficial but badly placed or, again, of opposing faction, the condition of parents will be mediocre and fluctuating.
As for the Part of Fortune, it seems to be linked to wealth. If it is in good harmony with the 'spearbearers', the children [ the chart owner] will receive, according to Ptolemy, the entire parental patrimony. If this is not the case, either because the 'spearbearers' are evil planets, or because they bring down an aspect of opposition to the Part of Fortune, the children will not benefit from the totality of the parental goods, which are even likely to cause them a number of problems.
What can astrologers like Vettius Valens or Rhetorius add to these observations of Ptolemy, concerning the situation and the fortune of the parents?
The condition of parents will be illustrious, affirms Valens, if their significators, as well as their Rulers, respect their Hairesis , if they occupy their dignity of domicile or of exaltation, or their joy, if they are touched by the 'supereminent aspect'  of a beneficial or by any other aspect coming from it, if they are not observed by the evil ones. Parents, on the other hand, will be subordinate and in the shadow if their significators occupy a place where they have no joy, or if they are afflicted by a strong evil planet, while their Ruler is under the rays. [Note: Combust or under the Beams]
Rhetorius, for his part, insists on the quality of the Ruler of significators, especially of the Ruler by triplicity. A well-configured Sun of the well-disposed father, whose Ruler by triplicity would not be, would announce a noble origin which would gradually deteriorate. On the other hand, an ill-configured Sun, whose triplicity Ruler would be well placed, would indicate a rather modest start in life, without brilliance, followed by
of a career rise. The first triplicity Ruler has a significance on the first part of life, the second on the second part. The Term Ruler [or decanate] of the significators also gives some clues about the condition of existence of the parents, the Sun for example, misplaced in the Term of an evil, will be a source of servility.
The same process should be applied for the significators of the Mother. Rhetorius specifies that a Moon in the Term of a beneficial, but located in a Cadent place, but in its nodes, by body or by aspect, but aspected by a malefic, manifests at the beginning a good condition of existence, which deteriorates and becomes poorer over time. Thus a Moon in the Term of an evil planet, his Ruler being in a cadent house, announces a servant mother.
3] Parents: their time of life
Let us return to the 'spearbearers' described by Ptolemy: although they are obviously essential for understanding the conditions of existence, they in no way intervene in the judgment on the longevity of parents. This is derived from the only configurations that affect the significators.
Concerning the father, for example, it is possible to predict a long life for him, if the two beneficial Jupiter and Venus are configured to the Sun or to Saturn, by any aspect whatsoever, or if Saturn makes a harmonious aspect to the Sun, by sextile or trine, both being in a strong position. In his Parisian seminar of November 29, 2008, Giuseppe Bezza had very opportunely clarified that the Sun-Saturn conjunction promised long life to the father, provided that these two stars are indeed arranged, that is to say Angular, Dignified by sign, faithful to their Haïresis. However, their weakness would not indicate the shortness of life.
On the other hand, injuring the Sun by square or opposition, Saturn will grant the father a short life after the sufferings of a long illness, even when the two stars fall from angles [the star is then in a "cadent" place [from Latin cadere, to fall], therefore very weak.]
Also short life, if they are Angular, especially in ASC and MC, therefore the most powerful, followed by the Succedent Houses. If they are in the two other angles, the DS and the FC, or in their Succendent Houses, the father will be subject to major illnesses or disabilities.
In a position of overcoming  relative to the Sun, Mars will abruptly destroy the life of the father or damage his eyesight. In a position of overcoming  over Saturn, it will signify sudden death from fevers, chills or injuries.
Concerning the mother, a long life will be attributed to her if Jupiter configures itself to the Moon and to Venus, by any aspect whatsoever, or if the Moon makes a harmonious aspect to Venus, by sextile, trine or conjunction, the two being in position of strength.
However, Mars observing the Moon or Venus, or even Saturn observing the Moon alone, by square or opposition, while these stars slow down or are in a cadent place, for the mother only health difficulties; but if they increase their speed or if they are Angular, the evil ones will produce either a short life or a life of disease. Short life especially when they are in the most powerful places, that is, in the Angles of the East or in their Succedent places. Sick life if they are in the less powerful Angles of the West.
Mars configuring itself with the Moon by square or opposition, the latter being Eastern, will cause sudden death of the mother or ophthalmic pathologies [eyes]; but, if the Moon is waning, it will cause death by abortion or childbirth, or disease by wounds or burns. If Mars configures itself to Venus in the same way, it will cause death by fevers or by diseases contracted in hidden places.
If Saturn observes the Moon, it will produce death and disease; if it is Oriental, by fever and chills, if it is Western, by uterine ulcer or sudden attacks. Generally speaking, the kind of disease will be discovered by the zodiacal signs where the destructive stars are located.
For the rest, and to find more information on the parents, Ptolemy judges that it would be coherent to consider the place of the father [the sign of the Sun or the sign of Saturn] as if it were the ASC of the father, the mother's place as if it were the mother's ASC, each signifier thus being the Ascendant of the parents' nativity.
From this new horoscope, it would be possible to develop, within the children's chart, a father chart and a mother chart with all their successive places and their meanings. In each of these new themes, we would look for the ruling planets, or the ruling planet, according to the method previously recommended by Ptolemy. The planet or planets with the most dignities and powerful configurations in this chart, which we would now call 'Derived Houses', will thus provide us with valuable information about the father and the mother.
Thus ends the chapter devoted by Ptolemy to parents.
But another question arises regarding the longevity of parents:
- Which of the two will die first?
Neither Vettius Valens nor Rhetorius will hesitate to answer it in great detail, which are summarized here:
As a general rule, Vettius Valens recommends observing which significator is most afflicted by the evil ones. If, for example, the Sun is injured by Saturn and Mars, without receiving the support of a benefic, the father will be the first to die. If the Moon and Venus are hit by the evil, the mother will be the first to disappear. If the parents' significators are both attacked by the evil ones, the one who is most badly located, for example in a cadent place, or the one who does not respect his Hairesis, will represent the one who dies first.
Other clues noted by Valens: the Part of the Father in a masculine sign, or his Ruler aspected by an evil, reveal that the father will end his life first. The Sun hurting the Moon by aspect of overcoming  announces that the mother will die first, while the Moon afflicting the Sun by the same aspect of overcoming  announces that the father will come to his term first. The one whose Luminary does not respect his Haïresis, the one who is wounded by an evil, and who, in the diurnal movement, will arrive first on the Descendant, will die first. The Moon or Venus in diurnal chart, afflicted under the horizon, applying to an evil, the mother will be the first to die [Anthologies, II, 30].
But the prize goes unquestionably to Rhetorius, who takes up the considerations of V. Valens, adding a few other points to them, such as for example:
- If the Ruler of the father is above the horizon, or if the Ruler of the mother is below the horizon, the mother will die first.
- If the Rulers of the Parts are in the same sign, the one who enters the evil rays first will say who will leave first.
- If the Rulers of the Parts are in the same sign and in the same degree, the Ruler of the Term in masculine sign will designate the father as the first to disappear, the Ruler of the Term in feminine sign the mother.
- Saturn on the same degree as the Moon will kill the mother first.
- The Sun on the eighth degree of a sign, or Mars and Saturn in the 4th house, will kill the father first.
- The Full Moon in Pisces, as well as the Void of Course Moon, will cause the father to die first.
To conclude, we can say that the signifier, placed outside his Haïresis, and the most afflicted by the evil ones, is always the one who will precipitate death, which once again underlines the importance of Haïresis and the destructive role. of life assigned to the evil ones, to Mars by its excess of hot and dryness, to Saturn by its excess of cold and dryness.
Danièle Jay - March 30, 2016
1 Haïresis: see my article in Echo d'Hermès n ° 12 of October 2011
Note: It designates the Sect Ruler. Please see her article for more info.
2 Part of the Father: in diurnal birth, distance from the Sun to Saturn reported from the AS. (AS+SA-SU) In nocturnal birth, the distance from Saturn to the Sun carried over from the AS. (AS+SU-SA) In the event that Saturn is combust (within 17 degrees of the SU, the distance from Mars to Jupiter is reported from the AS, day and night. (AS+JU-MA)
3 Part of the Mother: in diurnal birth, distance from Venus to the Moon reported from the AS.(AS+MO-VE) In nocturnal birth, distance from the Moon to Venus, reported from the AS. (AS+VE-MO) Note: I have added the formulas here.
4 Rhetorius the Egyptian, Astrological Compendium, by James H. Holden, published by the American Federation of Astrologers, Tempe, 2009, p. 145 and following.
5 Rhetorius the Egyptian, Astrological Compendium, by James H. Holden.
Added note: [A Ptolemaic term describing a planet which serves as a sort of bodyguard or John the Baptist to the Sun, rising shortly before it - either in the same or the contiguous Sign. The doryphory of the Moon similarly rises after it. best meaning of the word is spearbearer.] Nicholas deVore - Endyclopedia of Astrology
6 "Matutines": These are the planets that rose before the Sun. Paul of Alexandria expressly says: "the degrees and the signs which rise before the Sun, that is to say to its right, are called matutins, while the degrees, the signs and the part which is at the left of the Sun have a Vespertine nature ”[Boer p.30].
7 "Face": one of the essential dignities of a planet, responding to the Greek term idioprosopia. The reader can refer to my article devoted to essential dignities in Ptolemy, “Trois / Sept / Onze” of March 2016.
8 Rise of one star over another: kathuperteresis. The prominent star rose before the other and fell a square on it. We often find in ancient texts mention of a star "in elevation": it is then ''overcoming' , while having a latitude superior to that of the other.
Note: See Hellenistic Astrology, Chris Brennan p. 312 where he defines it as a planet 'having the upper hand' or 'superior position' by being on thé right vs the left. He does not mention the latitude but I have left it as stated in the article.
.Bezza, Giuseppe, Commento al primo libro della Tetrabiblos di Claudio Tolemeo
.Bezza, Giuseppe, Arcana Mundi, antologia del pensiero astrologico antico
.Bezza, Giuseppe, Scuola di Astrologia Classica
.Jay, Danièle, Le Ciel en mouvement, Editions Sep
.Ptolemy, Claude, Tetrabiblos, translated by Nicolas Bourdin, Editions Vernal / Philippe Lebaud, Paris, 19
.Robbins, Harvard University Press, London 1940, translated by Pascal Charvet, Nil Edit
.Rhetorius, Astrological Compendium, translated by James Herschel Holden, Phoenix Editions, Arizona, 2000.
.Vettius Valens, Anthologies
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group