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Frawley's Sports Astrology
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johannes susato



Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Posts: 1581

Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

skyrack wrote:
Spain v Croatia 1.60 6.50
Mars & Mercury v Venus & Jupiter

Moon Jupiter 0 Applicative +03:07:02 - negative
PoF Combust is DESTRUCTIVE for favourites - negative
Mars Saturn 180 Applicative +01:56:32 - negative

This should be interesting...


Thanks again for your judgment that I don't want to spoil, but the application
of the Moon to Jupiter is over the sign border, so it doesn't work, and the com-
bustion of the POF ist also beyond orbs.

Nevertheless it is still intersting to see, if the opposition of Saturn can make
Spain loose this match.
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skyrack



Joined: 02 Aug 2012
Posts: 250
Location: Thailand

Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 7:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry for the poor quote - with no reference as to its source, which was taken from my notes.

Frawley wrote:
The house placement of the Nodes doesn't seem significant, so for instance the North Node on the Ascendant doesn't favour the favourites. But significators falling on the Nodes will be helped or harmed. This is a powerful testimony. In this context, Fortuna can be taken as belonging to the favourite: Fortuna on the North Node helps the favourite; on the South Node it helps the underdog. Conjunctions only, within a couple of degrees at most.
p89

I have now tracked down a pdf copy of Sports Astrology and you are quite right:

Frawley wrote:
Combustion must be kept much tighter than usual. We can say that any significator within 2 degrees of the Sun is harmed.
p90

johannes susato wrote:
Thanks again for your judgment that I don't want to spoil, but the application
of the Moon to Jupiter is over the sign border, so it doesn't work, and the com-
bustion of the POF ist also beyond orbs.


Spoil away! I am here to learn and thanks for taking time to find flaws in my interpretation.

Yes- the Moon Jupiter aspect doesn't work.
I will add that check to my script along with the tight combust orb.

Interesting games tonight.
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johannes susato



Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Posts: 1581

Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2021 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now, as I see that you too have the SA at hand, I could answer questions by
quoting only the pages, for example.
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johannes susato



Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Posts: 1581

Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2021 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

skyrack wrote:
England v Germany 2.45 2.90
Mars & Mercury v Venus & Jupiter

1. Antiscion of Lord 1 inside 7th house favours the underdog.
2. Moon Mercury Antiscion 120 Exact +00:09:30
3. Moon Mercury 90 Applicative +05:41:06 - positive
4. Mars Saturn 180 Applicative +01:16:09 - afflicts the favourites

The Moon's last aspect is to Mercury (6 degree orb allowed as extra time is playable).
Will this outweigh the negative testimonies? I think not.


1. agreed
2. the Moon is too late by 9 minutes
3. agreed
4. orb only 1 degree (analogy to the new planets, p.90

And I would even add the Moon's application to the sextile of the Antiscion of Mars with an orb of 6.25 which is supported by the time range a penalty shoot-out could bring about.

And so England would be the winner, provided they are really the favourites.
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skyrack



Joined: 02 Aug 2012
Posts: 250
Location: Thailand

Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 5:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

johannes susato wrote:
skyrack wrote:
England v Germany 2.45 2.90
Mars & Mercury v Venus & Jupiter

1. Antiscion of Lord 1 inside 7th house favours the underdog.
2. Moon Mercury Antiscion 120 Exact +00:09:30
3. Moon Mercury 90 Applicative +05:41:06 - positive
4. Mars Saturn 180 Applicative +01:16:09 - afflicts the favourites

The Moon's last aspect is to Mercury (6 degree orb allowed as extra time is playable).
Will this outweigh the negative testimonies? I think not.


1. agreed
2. the Moon is too late by 9 minutes
3. agreed
4. orb only 1 degree (analogy to the new planets, p.90

And I would even add the Moon's application to the sextile of the Antiscion of Mars with an orb of 6.25 which is supported by the time range a penalty shoot-out could bring about.

And so England would be the winner, provided they are really the favourites.


2. You are right.
4. Agreed. I need to stick to a 1 degree orb for Saturn aspects.

if 5 degrees covers 90 minutes, and
1 degree covers 30 minutes of extra time,
I would allow 20 minutes only to cover the length of time for a penalty shoot out.

The odds I supply are frpm Bet365 which is an English based bookmaker,
A German bookmaker may well have had Germany as favourites.
But if money talks then England were the narrow favourites.
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johannes susato



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Posts: 1581

Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 8:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

skyrack wrote:
johannes susato wrote:
skyrack wrote:
England v Germany 2.45 2.90
Mars & Mercury v Venus & Jupiter

1. Antiscion of Lord 1 inside 7th house favours the underdog.
2. Moon Mercury Antiscion 120 Exact +00:09:30
3. Moon Mercury 90 Applicative +05:41:06 - positive
4. Mars Saturn 180 Applicative +01:16:09 - afflicts the favourites

The Moon's last aspect is to Mercury (6 degree orb allowed as extra time is playable).
Will this outweigh the negative testimonies? I think not.


1. agreed
2. the Moon is too late by 9 minutes
3. agreed
4. orb only 1 degree (analogy to the new planets, p.90

And I would even add the Moon's application to the sextile of the Antiscion of Mars with an orb of 6.25 which is supported by the time range a penalty shoot-out could bring about.

And so England would be the winner, provided they are really the favourites.


2. You are right.
4. Agreed. I need to stick to a 1 degree orb for Saturn aspects.

if 5 degrees covers 90 minutes, and
1 degree covers 30 minutes of extra time,
I would allow 20 minutes only to cover the length of time for a penalty shoot out.


The odds I supply are frpm Bet365 which is an English based bookmaker,
A German bookmaker may well have had Germany as favourites.
But if money talks then England were the narrow favourites.


Hi Skyrack,

at first I have to correct myself: the orb is even 10 minutes more, i.e. 6°35´.

Nevertheless I stick to my postulation of this large orb.

I think your time frame is a little bit too short: They play not only 90 minutes, but more, because there are always interruptions, let's say 5 minutes in each half (= 100 minutes). This time is added as stoppage time (= 110 minutes).

And this is why Frawly gives 5° for football matches and allows 1° degree more, "if extra time is possible", p.85, so 6 degrees.

With extra time and penalty shoot-out the match can last nearly 1 hour longer than those nearly two hours above, so in my opinion there should be no discussion about (6 degrees) +20 or +35 minutes.

At least the English have won, and there must be some - and good! - testimonies against their rather negative, their captivity in the German angle.
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johannes susato



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Posts: 1581

Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To make the long story of my above reasoning (today at 8:24 am) short:

S(ports A(strology), p. 97:

Seven degrees is the absolute limit of motion we can afford the Moon in a football match
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skyrack



Joined: 02 Aug 2012
Posts: 250
Location: Thailand

Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 1:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes indeed.. Thanks again for pointing that one out.
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johannes susato



Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Posts: 1581

Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2021 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

skyrack wrote:
Spain v Switzerland 1.66 5.50
Jupiter & Venus v Mercury & Mars

Moon Mercury 60 Exact +00:05:44 - negative


Agreed, but now the opposition between Mars and Saturn could/should(?) work.

So we had a positive and a possible negative.
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johannes susato



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Posts: 1581

Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2021 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I stick to the sextile.
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johannes susato



Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Posts: 1581

Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2021 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

johannes susato wrote:
I stick to the sextile.

And had better chosen the above mentioned opposition between
Mars and Saturn (positive for Spain).


Last edited by johannes susato on Fri Jul 02, 2021 10:01 pm; edited 3 times in total
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johannes susato



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Posts: 1581

Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2021 9:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

skyrack wrote:
Italy v Belgium 2.37 3.30
Saturn v Mars

No testimonies

But obviously the Opposition between Mars and Saturn, now within the
(probably fit) orb of 1° at most, has been here too the leffective testi-
mony (positive for Italy).
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skyrack



Joined: 02 Aug 2012
Posts: 250
Location: Thailand

Posted: Sat Jul 03, 2021 5:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

But the Mars Saturn opposition has been and gone before the Spain v Switzerland match started. It is NOT applicable for that match nor the later Italy v Belgium match.
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johannes susato



Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Posts: 1581

Posted: Tue Jul 06, 2021 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

skyrack wrote:
Italy v Spain 2.40 3.25 3.10

Jupiter & Mars v Mercury & Venus


Moon Venus 60 Applicative +02:58:02 - negative
Moon Mars 60 Applicative +06:55:59 - positive (if goes to penalties?)

Venus Saturn 180 Applicative +00:24:08 - positive


There is a final application of the Moon to conjoin the antiscion of the POF
with an orb of only 8 minutes.

If the Moon would already separate, then her sextile to Mars would help the
Italians to win, because that greater orb of 7 degress is given if penalties are
possible; you can't know before the match.
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skyrack



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Posts: 250
Location: Thailand

Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2021 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is an aspect between the Moon and POF antiscion and which is FINAL - nullifying the later Moon aspects.

But I make it that that aspect is a Trine applying by 37 minutes.
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